2018 Europeans Ladies FS

[qwertyskates]

I have a genuine question about the vicotry ceremony for ladies. I have been watching figure skating for some years now and noticed that there is an unspoken "rule" that after the medal ceremony skaters go greet and thank the audience and the winner basically always goes first. I always thought it's nice and just common courtesy and manners to let the winner go first at least for the first round. I even rewatched some finals to check if I remember it right and I am definitely correct on this. I always liked Evgenia, she seems like a sweet person and a pretty good skater so I have to say it struck me as incredibly rude of her to spring off the podium and run to go greet the audience first... She did not even look behind her If the winner is following, she did not let Alina go first, she went really fast and never looked back. Honestly I am somewhat dissapointed with that behavior. Do somebody have any idea why she did that?

I noticed too that Zagi seemed to be too shy to move into the spotlight, while Med embraced it. It was apparent also at the end of the Gala when they took pictures, Med was in the middle of the group while having photos taken with an official, she looked for Alina to come pose in the middle with her, but Alina was painfully shy and kept to the edge.

I think that's why Med is much more comfortable being in the champion position, she's really great for the media, for the crowds, as a fs star, but she also tries to pull in Alina to join in the spotlight. I think she remains the big sister and Alina looks up to her a lot, which is why Alina looks almost pained to have won the gold, and rightfully, it belongs to her.

It isn't Med's fault that Alina is such a reluctant star, and Med seems to be looking out for her. Somebody has to be there in front, and Med has to step up for the occasion and audience.

I can see this dynamic played out and I love the two girls for this.:agree2:

 

[madison]

I noticed too that Zagi seemed to be too shy to move into the spotlight, while Med embraced it. It was apparent also at the end of the Gala when they took pictures, Med was in the middle of the group while having photos taken with an official, she looked for Alina to come pose in the middle with her, but Alina was painfully shy and kept to the edge.

I think that's why Med is much more comfortable being in the champion position, she's really great for the media, for the crowds, as a fs star, but she also tries to pull in Alina to join in the spotlight. I think she remains the big sister and Alina looks up to her a lot, which is why Alina looks almost pained to have won the gold, and rightfully, it belongs to her.

It isn't Med's fault that Alina is such a reluctant star, and Med seems to be looking out for her. Somebody has to be there in front, and Med has to step up for the occasion and audience.

I can see this dynamic played out and I love the two girls for this.:agree2:

Little Zagi is so shyyyy, but this is part of her charm.
It's a true miracle that she survived with Eteri, cause she's exactly the opposite of Eteri's ideal student.

 

[Artistry]

Such harsh hate for Alina, her costume, etc. - come on! She's 15 years old and I find both of her programs fabulous technically AND artistically. All you splitting hairs about ballet and "ballet poses" and how to translate it yo ice, have you actually ever SEEN Kitri variations? This was a perfect interpretation of the ballet.

 

[Miss Ice]

Most athletes are driven by an inside desire to improve themselves and their abilities. It’s often an obsession! I think you are projecting onto Alina here. She will improve as much as she possibly can because that’s what elite athletes do. They love the sport and not the scores. Yes they strive to achieve the highest score possible but they usually speak about the performance and not the score. They aren’t lying...they are very competitive! It’s the fans who obsess about the scores. I’m not sure why you think Alina is trying to do as little as possible. I see no indications to suggest this and she seems very driven to me.

Um, and what is she supposed to be "improving" if her PCS is already near the 10's? You are the one who is speculating here. I'm just taking the next logical step from the data (near-10's and GOE +3/+2) that are given to Zagitova. Regarding your bold line - what a joke. Do you see Medvedeva improving her flutzes and URs? Nope. I don't. Mao improved her flutz and started jumping correct after it was harshly called for several seasons. Medvedeva clearly thinks she can get away with a flutz and URs (or doesn't even realize the latter are there) because no one is calling it. Stop pretending like feedback mechanism doesn't exist between skaters and judging. Especially when the judging in question is incorrect.

Also, I never said Orser is a good choice for Zagitova. Maybe he is, maybe he isn't. But a coach change might be a good improvement.

I also love how this is apparently "hate" even though I actually think that Zagitova has a lot of potential and can do a lot of good things when in the hands of a good coach/choreography. At this point, she is just being groomed to take the OGM. I doubt that she will have 1+ more seasons after she hits puberty if things keep going the way they are. History will reveal itself, as it did already with quite a few skaters.

 

[Miss Ice]

That doesn't establish your superior knowledge. IJS has been around for over 10 years now. It isn't rocket science. You have your favorites; so do others. That makes you a fan just like everyone else.

So you think the tech specialists and judges who give +1.60 GOE for FLUTZES and +1 GOE for UR jump combos have superior knowledge? I think it's time to wake up. The system is broken and the judging is as rigged as it can be. Thank goodness people like BoP are stepping up and pointing out the ridiculousness of it all. Glad to see the B.ESP commentators coming around to. Even they can't eat the trash that is being fed to them from the judges forever.

EDIT: Sorry for double post, meant to do a post edit.

 

[[email protected]]

Such harsh hate for Alina, her costume, etc. - come on! She's 15 years old and I find both of her programs fabulous technically AND artistically. All you splitting hairs about ballet and "ballet poses" and how to translate it yo ice, have you actually ever SEEN Kitri variations? This was a perfect interpretation of the ballet.

At least she took some hate off Medvedeva. It's like in Star Wars: "This is getting out of hand: now there are two of them". I just laugh at all the "experts" here. Next years it will be "more of them" - JGPF was an "early warning". What are they going to say then?

 

[Baron Vladimir]

There are skaters, judges, and officials who have been here and even posted, it's not just a "fan board". I post here because I like having a centralized place to talk about skating, with anyone in the world. Information should be shared and better understood by all. My name is Tim Gerber, I'm a former skater who trained as a tech specialist and choreographer. I've worked with people inside (and outside) the ISU for many years at creating reforms to ice skating and changes to the scoring system. I can link you to some reading material if you'd like, I'm also doing an interview with NBC for this upcoming Olympics.

I thought you are Koola King :dance2: :dance2: :dance2:

 

[Ares]

How is going to Orser makes you a more expressive skater? He won't make a Yuna out of any skater, it doesn't work like that.

But at least different choreography without desperate trying to fit her into ballerina mould & tutu would help. I don't think it's a matter of coach in that case, albeit I'd maybe like Alina to leave Eteri but for different reasons. She does not show any sympathy to her at all if anything something totally opposite.

 

[eppen]

The ladies free was of surprisingly poor quality overall. There were relatively few highlights in the first groups. Sometimes the season's bests came as a bit of a surprise because the skate was bad and still ended up being a SB. Like with Emmi Peltonen who would be such a brilliant skater if she could keep her head - and the jumps - together. Great performance quality, brill finish and expressiveness!

Loena Hendricx was back to her form from a season or so ago. Maybe that summer camp with Javi in August was just what she needed?! She still needs to develop her expression a lot, but this one was altogether good to watch. We were wondering how the sister/brother teams were doing compared to each other and I think it was the Brezina-Brezinovas who did overall better - both delivered, Jorik did bad in the free.

At least the last group was exciting! Well, apart from Anita Östlund who was having a steep learning curve day. Her better days will hopefully be ahead of her. It was tough to watch...

Sotskova is quite boring to watch. She really is The Sleeping Pill. Even Russians failed to react to her with great enthusiasm (and not only bcs of the fall).

Kostner's new costume was really not very good. At least from our point of view her lines were blurred and the sparkle was distracting from the main business. It is still hard to know what one can expect from Carolina - the SP was out of this world, but the FS a good reminder that she has not really changed even with age and huge amount of experience. Her score was generous, but I was happy to see her on the podium nevertheless.

Medvedeva was very good despite the botched lutz combo. This program gives her a bit more time to finish the movement and for the audience to appreciate her story telling skills. The jumps though - low, slow, short, laboured, no running edge... She is clearly the star, though. Zagitova remains still a bit unknown.

And Zag? The first part is marred by unfinished and plain ugly movement. The second part is a little better with the jumps which were really on. I like the fast part with the 3 last jumps from the point of view of the choreo that has actually a relationship with the music. In the interview it was quite clear that she really is still just a little kid.

In the victory ceremony, the way Med hardly knew were the second place was on the podium was rather funny! She has taken her first loss in ages graciously and professionally. But I think she has a mountain to climb in the olympics if her tech remains at this level. No room for errors whatsoever if Zag skates clean...

 

[Kinga]

If they are both vying for the ONE Olympic spot, both coming from the same country, and with ONLY these two same country skaters doing a costume change (Laurine's costume change is already known since her Grease program), and one program is done like a mocking parody of costume change (come on, the boos.....)I won't preclude the possibility. A lot of people scratched their heads about Mae's FS, including me, as I forgot about Grease. And when I saw Laurine's FS, then it struck me! Even while performing her Marilyn Monroe FS, Laurine did Grease as her exhibition with costume change.

Tbh, I like Laurine as a skater but find her programs and taste questionable.

If Mae really designed her LP around ridiculing Laurine's costume change, that is lame and bad sportmanship. If you question your direct competitor's choices, find the best reply by putting together a great program. Her LP is opposite of that and works against her. It is even worse than Laurine's Grease (yeah, I really dislike that program and costumes e change. I actually don't know which of those programs I loathe more).

Her LP was judged 4th of the night, not 3rd. She was third overall because of her excellent SP, which was arguably underscored. And she didn't have a 2 triples content. She had 3 clean triples. But to answer your initial question...yes, those qualities are important in figure skating since it is not only a jumping contest.

By this logic, let's put a female ice dancer in ladies competition. There will be plenty of good edges and elegance. I actually don't argue whether her bronze medal was right or not - the SP was really exclusive. Close call to me. But she she should have lost LP to Sotskova by higher margin. And lose to Hendrickx. Heck, I think Micol Cristiani LP was better.
(Sorry for my mistake, it was 4th LP of the night indeed)

 

[Mathman]

I think it is Evgenia, rather than Alina, who is handicapped by being up against the IJS scoring ceiling. Alina has a clear lead in element base values, and at this late date Evgenia's likelihood of successfully making any technical upgrades is slight (more risk than reward, IMHO). Evgenia can skate lights out and get all 3's in GOE and 79 in PCSs. But Alina will also get good GOEs and will not get less than 74 or 75.

If Alina makes no mistakes, I think she has to be regarded as the firm favorite now.

 

[VenusHalley]

Such harsh hate for Alina, her costume, etc. - come on! She's 15 years old and I find both of her programs fabulous technically AND artistically. All you splitting hairs about ballet and "ballet poses" and how to translate it yo ice, have you actually ever SEEN Kitri variations? This was a perfect interpretation of the ballet.

I don't think it's hate, especially not towards her. But she deserves interesting programs where backloading is not the main thing... and some pretty sparkly dress that does not look like from circus sale.


For be problem with "ballet on ice" type of skating was... that is sometimes does not translate. If one wears skates instead of pointed shoes... it's different field of art. Use advantages and possibilities of the skating more...

 

[FSLover17]

There are skaters, judges, and officials who have been here and even posted, it's not just a "fan board". I post here because I like having a centralized place to talk about skating, with anyone in the world. Information should be shared and better understood by all. My name is Tim Gerber, I'm a former skater who trained as a tech specialist and choreographer. I've worked with people inside (and outside) the ISU for many years at creating reforms to ice skating and changes to the scoring system. I can link you to some reading material if you'd like, I'm also doing an interview with NBC for this upcoming Olympics.

Are you by any chance the same person who wrote a letter to the ISU about the Sochi step sequence? If so, it was a very detailed and helpful analysis for skating fans like me aren't as educated on the ins and outs of judging like me

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

Are you by any chance the same person who wrote a letter to the ISU about the Sochi step sequence? If so, it was a very detailed and helpful analysis for skating fans like me aren't as educated on the ins and outs of judging like me

Yes..BoP brings the passion!

 

[Jedi]

Yes..BoP brings the passion!

And other stuff too

 

[Baron Vladimir]

And other stuff too

:rofl2: (you meant blades) :rofl2:

 

[Crossover]

I hatethe tutu too. It's too forceful and looks.... childish. Like little kid going for carneval dress as ballerina without actually knowing how to do ballet.

IT seems the tutu is there to make us think Alina is ballerina.... she is not. I would be interested to see her skate to something fresher edgier that would take advantage of her athletic side.

While her tutus break her lines and flows, so her hunched posture is more noticeable (the SP opening is so....:noshake, I can somehow understand why her team dresses her in tutus. They definitely draw your attention whether you like or not and you consider her balletic or not. I don't think they will throw them away at all considering how possibly the media can name her like "New Ballerina on ice", so my suggestion is that at least they can package her as much as close to Natalie Portman in Black Swan (I'd argue that she resembles the actress in appearance a bit), not with the cheep looking SP costume. The SP costume is far from swans, but rather like feral pigeons, magpies or even crows.

 

[jenaj]

With a few days to think about the results here, it seems likely that Zagitova will win the OGM. Evgenia has lost her air of invinceability (if that is a word). I do not like Zagi's extreme backloading, but that is the system. And Evgenia was the first to do it in her short program. I do hope they change the rules after the Olympics. PCS should take into account
the overall distribution of the elements. And the bonus in the short program should probably be eliminated.

 

[kevinVchicago]

Watching the last group of Euros with my mom. On seeing Zagitova the first time, halfway through the program: "She's amazing! This is gonna knock the other girl back to Italy." [emoji23][emoji23][emoji23]
On Zagitova's scores: "Well at least they got that right!" [emoji23][emoji23][emoji23]

I love you Mom!

 

[Mathman]

I don't think [zagitova's team] will throw [the tutus] away at all considering how possibly the media can name her like "New Ballerina on ice", so my suggestion is that at least they can package her as much as close to Natalie Portman in Black Swan (I'd argue that she resembles the actress in appearance a bit), not with the cheep looking SP costume. The SP costume is far from swans, but rather like feral pigeons, magpies or even crows.

I hope they come out with something fresh each season. Ballerinas and magpies this year, something completely off the wall next.

Alina: https://i.pinimg.com/236x/8c/b4/55/8cb45519da7b1ad4bbdec788428187b4.jpg

Magpies: https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net..._jeckle.gif/revision/latest?cb=20140617040224