Long spirals do not help to collect more points anymore.
So few current skaters do those beautiful old-school spirals any more. A notable exception: Karen Chen, who showed everyone how it’s done at US Nationals and Four Continents this year.
I completely agree--Americans have no monopoly on either the appreciation or the performance of jaw-droppingly beautiful spirals..
One of the things that was so great about Michelle Kwan's change of edge spiral innovation was that she got "credit" for two different spirals (forward-right-inside and forward-right-outside) without having to drop the free leg - it seemed like one long glorious hold of position. It was one of those subtle things that must have been a lot harder than it looked, because although it was a technique that was copied many times, it was never done as well as she did it.
Agree Jason has a great spiral, but the best men's spiral I've seen was a Canadian about a decade or so ago. I think it was Shawn Sawyer... I'll have to research that.
I never said they did.
Nor did I say that you said they did. :confused2: I was agreeing with TontoK (whom I did quote), who seemed to me to be responding to a previous post--not yours--characterizing a love of spirals as an "American 'obsession'". I was attempting to second his point constructively and contribute to the thread generally by offering another example of a pair with terrific spirals.
And since I'm home, I can now post links:
1988 Olympic LP (I'll never get tired of watching the whole thing, but the link is to the beginning of the spiral)
1994 Olympic LP
And a bonus: their "Reverie" exhibition, performed here at the 1994 Olympics, which begins with a spiral sequence and has another beauty later.
It's not surprising that three out of the four skaters on your list are American; American audiences always seemed to show more appreciation for a good spiral than almost any other element. Amd advertisements for televised events almost always included a female skater in a spiral beaming away.
I wonder if it is a cultural thing...
Yes it was Shawn Sawyer. From his Skate America FS in 2009, check out the spiral at about 3:25. Stunning. I think the rest of the program was less successful.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nCVg1PM_jGk
if you don't understand, this is not about "ballet standards", but about cultural preferences.
Well, you said, "If a lady skater has gentle, flexible hands like the wings of a swan - like Maiia here - this has a very strong aesthetically effect on me. I know that this is certainly determined by the Russian, ballet cultural tradition." And I was unnecessarily harsh but it is the truth that those wrists and hands aren't ones that Baryshnikov or Vaganova would like. Maybe Diaghilev would be chill with it.
Well frankly I'm having a hard time following you because you keep citing "culture" as the reason for liking Maiia's hands because they seem balletic to you, but I'm telling you that ballet masters actually wouldn't approve of the way she holds her hands! I'm no connoisseur, but I am a trained dancer. You can like her hands--I have no issue with that--but I think it's important to say that these aren't traditional ballet hands. That's fine! They don't need to be ballet hands--I'm all for seeing skating done to hip hop if the skater is committed! I don't think ballet is the highest form--it's not useful to compare different mediums and forms of art--but I also know that Maiia's hands are not traditionally balletic. That's all.For me, Maiia has beautiful hands. It was not about the fact that I am a refined connoisseur of ballet. I almost never watched it. But I grew up in a culture where ballet is highly valued and it has a strong influence on the types of artistic activities that are somehow related to it - dancing, gymnastics, figure skating, etc., thereby forming an aesthetic agenda. And thus influencing me. Now do you understand what I mean? Once again, we talked about the cultural impact on aesthetic perception.
P.S. Don't worry, we've all realized that you are a fine connoisseur of ballet
Ok so there were issues with the jumps but he is like a combo of Toller Cranston and Jason Brown - such a lovely quality about his skating - too bad about his consistency issues. If he were more consistent he would have been able to compete with Jeffrey, Evan, Plushenko, Chan and Takahashi and all. Canada had some great potential in skaters like Sawyer and Sandu.Yes it was Shawn Sawyer. From his Skate America FS in 2009, check out the spiral at about 3:25. Stunning. I think the rest of the program was less successful.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nCVg1PM_jGk
who care?but I also know that Maiia's hands are not traditionally balletic.