Daniil Gleikhengauz's programs

[ancientpeas]

If we ain't complaining we are probably not watching closely enough.

I judge programs two different way when it comes to choreography: How does it suit the music and how committed is the person/persons to giving a good performance of that choreography. If one is given terrible choreography but really works it and commits I'm much more positive than with someone who is given great choreography and gives a cruddy performance of it. And Eteri's ladies are usually very committed to their programs.

In the end the judges love it and it works for the Sambo group so I'm not sure why Eteri would want to risk changing it. I think it will be someone like Alina or Alena who says "I want to work with Shae-lynn or Misha Ge or Krylova" for them to change things up. Why would you tinker with a winning formula?

 

[ancientpeas]

I think Zhenya and Daniil working together is not that unlikely.
Its not like Daniil worked a lot with her, since most of her programs were doen by Averbukh. So my guess is that there are no or minor bad feelings.

But overall, does not have to be Zhenya, just any other team. Because overall, i feel that Daniil choreo has a "team" style also, which is present in choreos of Eteri team that were not done by Daniil.

Wouldn't it be fun if for one year everyone had to use someone they'd never used before? I'd actually love to see more ice dancers working with single skaters.

 

[vesperalvioletta]

If I remember correctly, Eteri did Kostornaya's Adios Nonino and Alina's Don Q, so I'm not sure we can give Daniil credit there. I do think he has his moments though. He's had a lot of creative program ideas, but not all of them reached their full potential, mostly due to the questionable music cuts in my opinion. I've really enjoyed the following from him:

Shcherbakova's A comme amour short and her Chopin short program from last year
Kostornaya's Stella's Theme free skate, which I think he did
Tsurskaya's free skate from last season
Trusova's Big Spender short and her Kill Bill short
Tarakanova's Experience short

And if he did Valieva's short program this year, I am very impressed.

 

[rikaquegira]

I think people call those programs similar because they are all equally full of details. Then, some users, instead of actually looking into the matter and comparing, say "they are all cluttered", without thinking too much.
The logic is same as if someone would say Kostner's programs are all the same because every program has long jump setups.

They are similar in the sense that they share the same style: lots of transitions, almost no room for breathing. With that, usually comes the inability of the skater to actually finish the movements or hold a position, which many figure skating fans(me included) find not only more aesthetically pleasing but ultimately essential. That’s why I prefer programs a bit less busy.

But there are exceptions, like I said, I love Alina’s DQ, even though it is probably one of the busiest programs in history. But I don’t know, there’s something about it, it just works! Perhaps is the music choice.

Because nothing bothers me more than a choreography that does not goes along or enhance the music! That usually happens with those kind of slow, emotional music.
I can’t stand when there’s a slow section and the skater is not following that structure, instead they are just moving frenetically just for the sake of “TR marks” even though it doesn’t match the music at all. That is one of the criticism I have to some of Daniil’s work.

But anyway, I’ve had this discussion before on some other thread, of how Daniil actually captures the skater’s personality very well and brings out their best qualities and their own style in each program, so I wouldn’t say his programs are all the same.

 

[esteticlove]

I think people call those programs similar because they are all equally full of details. Then, some users, instead of actually looking into the matter and comparing, say "they are all cluttered", without thinking too much.
The logic is same as if someone would say Kostner's programs are all the same because every program has long jump setups.

Well, some of us do look at the details. I am a fan of Team Eteri and do pay attention to their programs. And from my observations there's a similar pattern in every program: jumping on high notes, spinning when the music gets fast, complementing other notes with hand movements, often also just gliding fast when the music is actually slow. I think the main problem is not really Daniil's work but the fact that they are now having like what? at least 4 students (they used to be more) on the top level, where everyone is watching at them and people notice the similarities in style. This doesn't mean that he's a bad choreographer and definitely not the only one witch such a "problem". I think that his colleges in the field also go out of ideas very fast, we just don't see so much of those programs at once.

 

[Alexz]

I think Carolina pretty much classes up the joint where ever she goes so.. I'm sure Daniil would give her a good program. I think he is young and learning. Working with Kostner or Satoko would be excellent experience for him I think and I'm sure both ladies would learn a lot of from working with him. It's all growth, it's all education if you allow it to be. An open mind is open. A closed mind is closed.

I agree. Daniil is still evolving and just in process of establishing himself as choreographer. Still learning. But potentially he can be really good. He is getting there. Whatever he is doing he is not making people indifferent. Hate and disgust is also an emotion after all.

BTW. Having a mother as former ballerina of Bolshoi doesn't hurt too. I think she definitely never become a prima of Bolshoi, but was a (or soloist (or first soloist or even leading soloist?) at least. I need to check on that. I can ask few of my Moscow ballet buffs and old-timers I used to know about Daniil's mother. So we will know better about her credentials. But, honestly, to be with Bolshoi for years already means a lot. Any given Bolshoi girl even from the corps de ballet would be a soloist right off the bat anywhere else in the world almost at her first or second year with the foreign company. And subsequently would have a very successful career abroad. Oh, well... We seen many occasion already when young (straight out Vaganova) Russian ballerina would be told that due to her 'imperfections' and lack of perfect technic she would never ever raise rank higher than a soloist, but just year later this ballerina would travel abroad join any ballet company, quickly raise into prima and have a sparklingly dazzling international career.

And I agree with you it's about the mutual exchange between skater/dancer and choreographer in process if creating choreographical piece. Choreographer should explain what every move means, and skater should throw in some of his/her inputs, small suggestions and artistic requests.

Although it's highly personalized. I know few ballet dancers who admit they are not creative at all and admit they have a horrible taste, so they feel more comfortable just to dance whatever choreographer picks for them and asks/showes them to. With some good explanation along the way. Simply put... Some open minds can sometimes be mistaken about their taste and ability to create/pick good choreography themselves. And some closed minds can sometime be intentionally closed just out of laziness or out leadership despotism. Personal creativity, practical realism and/or understanding of the lack of choreographic talent in yourself. And a courage to accept things you are bad at and get some good help for it. Balance should be somewhere in between.

Not everyone can create choreography. Not everyone who thinks he/she can pick a suitable music for himself/herself. Not everyone who thinks she/he have a good taste can see herself/himslef from the side as independent taste-police. Not everyone who wants to suggest few good moves to his/her choreographer could come up actually something really good. Not every choreographer who despotically thinks what only him/her knows what works best is just a bad tyrant or perfectly good choreographer. The truth is somewhere in between.

It all depends on the particular skater and choreographer. Choreography preferably should has a highly personalized approach in every case. But here is a small paradox at the same time - we all know a lot of ballet choreographers who strictly insist on solemnly theirs specific way of choreography (Balanchine, Grigorovich, McMillan, Petipa to name the few) .. And their choreography is just amazing and wonderful! Proved by time. Imagine if those spoiled ballerinas of past would constantly changing and making unnecessary and silly suggestions to all those famous ballet choreographers? All famous and world-renown primas of modern age and the past just humbly accept all the rules and ways of famous choreographers - because they know they would look absolutely rocking on the stage. No matter how mechanical and lacking of musicality they initially are. There are usually no golden universal rule in choreography that applies equally good on every one, but there are many examples when those old and famous choreography pieces still looks good on anyone today. So sometimes - yes, choreographer knows better. And coach too. Just because of the age and experience. And more adult, trained and educated taste.

It's hard to imagine if 14-years old Trusova or 17-years old Medvedeva would know better than their choreographer and coach what kind of choreography and plasticity would look better on them. IMHO, they should just trust each other. Certainly, skater would perform better if she/he likes the music and choreography. It would subconsciously look more cheerful and alive, so to speak. However, there could be case of a young skater stubbornly insisting on some particular music or choreography without the ability to perform it at her highest. Seasoned skaters like Caro already know themselves well enough to specifically ask for something they have in mind style- and choreography-wise.

I would be very interested in seeing what Caro and Daniil could come up together for her SP (or just an EX program for starters and to see how it goes). I think Daniil can be so bit more initiative here.. Why won't he contact Caro directly and offer her a small idea for EX what he has in mind, but his current youngsters can't perform properly yet. Or what if Caro becomes a choreographer (well, she has a taste, and possibly after few years of studying) - I would be very interested in seeing her choreographing one or two for Zagitova or Eteri's Triple-A squad for Olympics 2022..

Hey, ya 'all, just imagine Kostornaya skating to something Kostneresque or Maoesque?

Sorry for possible misspellings, I'm currently in the park by the beach and lost one of my contact lenses. I typed with one eye open! "" - literally. Lol.

 

[Alexz]

Wouldn't it be fun if for one year everyone had to use someone they'd never used before? I'd actually love to see more ice dancers working with single skaters.

This.

 

[Alexz]

I definitely agree Eteri camp needs another choreographer, I don’t know who would be a good addition though.

And I think Eteri camp just need 2 more choreographers to make it even more competitive choreography-wise and bring more flavors and options to Eteri girls. So there would be 3 choreographers for Triple-A team.

 

[Alexz]

Yep, it would be interesting to see him work with different skaters, because right now he is basically "team eteri" choreographer.

As a matter of fact Daniil is not exclusively team Eteri choreographer. He was hired to make many other choreography pieces for few other Russian teams and foreign skater as well.

 

[Alexz]

Just a thought. What if Eteri and Sambo-70 hire Misha Ge into their team? He is young, he is fresh, he is fun and upbeat. Has a good taste and style. He would be a great addition for their team. Besides, he already worked on that ice rink. I remember him doing EX (and SP?) for Anya Pogorilaya. They can contract him for 4-5 months a year. Every year. July - November.

 

[IndiaP12]

I don’t get all this wanting new people to come and choreograph with Daniil or you guys wanting new choreo for these kids. I think he has choreographed programs for them that all suit their different styles perfectly. He doesn’t just choreograph the same thing. I wouldn’t have it any other way really; his choreography is perfect for my taste (but then this is only opinion!) Another choreography would just be weird, although I do agree it would be quite interesting to have a little bit of collab with someone else maybe just for EX tho...

 

[halulupu]

He is doing so many choreographies. Most of them are ok, some of them are pretty good and suit the style of the different skaters. Of course when you do so many some are mehh. But what I don't understand is that the worst ones are for his most decorated skater aka the olymic champion. I mean poto is just plainly chessy and bad. Carmen doesn't seem to have a great choreo either but maybe alina is also not able to pull it off yet (still early in the season and main focus on regaining the jumps). We will see.

 

[chopinskate]

To each his own, I guess.To me, Alina Zagitova's Phantom program is wonderful. As it gets more mileage, Alina will improve her pacing and breathing. But on the other hand, the frenetic dash of it all has it's own delight, to me.

I actually think she isn't doing a bad job performing it, and she does exhibit all her usual qualities in it anyway, which I think might be painting the choreography itself as something great. It doesn't have a great deal of unity in concept.

Come to think of it, Medvedeva's programs with Eteri were sort of the same. Overstuffed choreography which she still looked natural doing, which gave the choreography more mileage (and perhaps fans) than it deserved.

 

[halulupu]

I actually think she isn't doing a bad job performing it, and she does exhibit all her usual qualities in it anyway, which I think might be painting the choreography itself as something great. It doesn't have a great deal of unity in concept.

yeah its really not her doing a bad job. it is the choreo and the music cuts

 

[Alexz]

I did a quick search. Here is a good interview with Daniil. http://www.absoluteskating.com/index.php?cat=interviews&id=2018gleichengauz

 

[Baron Vladimir]

Umm, sound effects is Averbukh stuff mostly Just saying.
As for his programs, keep in mind that judges seem to LOVE them, so maybe it is an issue of your comprehension and taste.

Judges dont judge programs per se, but only how skaters are skating them. I mean, they like Alina's skating of the program, not necesserily the program she is skating to

 

[Sugar Coated]

Overall I think Daniil is a very good choreographer considering how young he is and I suspect he may become really great with time. I know the Don Q program started as Eteri’s program and was recycled from Zhenya, correct? But I think Daniil improved upon it for Alina. While I personally hate the POTO and the R+J voiceovers, they are starting to grow on me (more so POTO). And I understand the need to take chances and attempt to expand ones style in a non Olympic year which means you may have some duds for programs.

I also wonder what his programs might look like if he was not constrained to maximize scores at all costs. I think this is sometimes a reason they look cluttered and jam packed with elements. It’s team Eteri’s strategy to get the most points possible, which of course makes complete sense, but I do think at times that comes at a sacrifice for overall artistic style of the programs.

 

[moriel]

As a matter of fact Daniil is not exclusively team Eteri choreographer. He was hired to make many other choreography pieces for few other Russian teams and foreign skater as well.

Yep, but most of "his" top skaters are still team Eteri.

 

[moriel]

Just a thought. What if Eteri and Sambo-70 hire Misha Ge into their team? He is young, he is fresh, he is fun and upbeat. Has a good taste and style. He would be a great addition for their team. Besides, he already worked on that ice rink. I remember him doing EX (and SP?) for Anya Pogorilaya. They can contract him for 4-5 months a year. Every year. July - November.

Yep, and he would probably fit their mindset.
Because honestly, one of the reasons Daniil is doing so well there is that he is more CoP and less 6.0 due to his age. Most of his own skating career was under CoP already, for instance.

 

[Baron Vladimir]

It’s team Eteri’s strategy to get the most points possible, which of course makes complete sense, but I do think at times that comes at a sacrifice for overall artistic style of the programs.

Its a strategy of all coaches and choreographers. The difference we see is for another reasons. Some skaters are better in more lyrical style of performance, some in athletic style of performance. Some are better in lines and positions, some in speed and motions. Some expressing in one way, some in another etc etc Music and characters can be performed in many different ways, so some will use one style, some will use another...