2015-16 Grand Prix Final Mens SP

[shiroKJ]

From ISU

A Spin that has no basic position with 2 revolutions will receive no Level and
no value, however a spin with less than three rotations is considered as a
skating movement and not a spin.
The minimum number of revolutions required in a position is two (2) without
interruption. In case this requirement is not fulfilled, the position is not counted.
Variations of positions of the head, arms or free leg, as well as fluctuations of
speed are permitted.

 

[Interspectator]

From ISU

Thanks!
So...since Chan broke the position before completing 2 revolutions it was invalidated? Hmmm.

 

[karne]

Thanks!
So...since Chan broke the position before completing 2 revolutions it was invalidated? Hmmm.

If he did then yes, this would be an invalid spin. (caveat being that I will not have a chance to watch until tonight.)

I am grouchy today because I thought this was tomorrow and I was like, "Okay, it's at a reasonable hour!" But instead it was today and I had to go to work and miss it.

Regarding the 10s: my issue with them lies in this way. Ten is the absolute maximum. So what do the judges do when Hanyu gets better (and I have no reason to think that he won't)? Where do they go from here?

Alternatively, you could view it as the judges saying, "It's no longer possible for you to get better".

I have this concern whenever I see a 10 on the protocol and I've long thought that PCS is now far too high - for everyone. There's no room left.

 

[drivingmissdaisy]

I don't have a problem with the 10s. Everything was performed flawlessly. I can't think of another skater who has performed a program without earning a single +1 score from any judge in GOE. I enjoy watching a flawless Patrick a bit more because to me he has a better line and carriage, but Yuzu's combination of artistry and technical content was magnificent to see.

 

[Ophelia]

Regarding the questions why Chan wasn't prepared for zayaking...

“We’re already doing so much out there on the ice so I don’t really think about the rules going into the program,” Chan said. “I don’t study the rulebook off the ice.”

http://www.thestar.com/sports/skati...ing-sixth-out-of-six-at-grand-prix-final.html

Me thinks someone needs to be a more strategic competitor.

 

[VIETgrlTerifa]

People act like the 1.0-10.0 scale on PCS is not relative to what the standard in skating is, but it really is. Otherwise, how does one determine "good" "great" or whatever terms are used in defining what each PCS score is supposed to mean. It has to be relative because it's quantifying qualitative and subjective things. It's not like a jump that's easily identifiable. I don't mind 10.0s if we get something that truly was out of the ordinary and rare and special in the the time the performance happened. If we keep playing a game of "what if something was better..." or trying to interject our very own ideas of the perfect routine with the perfect execution with the perfect skater only deserving a ten, then the 10.0 will always only be a hypothetical and unattainable. I don't think a scoring system should have any score that's unattainable. Extremely difficult to receive, yes, but unattainable, no.

I wonder how many people said that Nadia Comeneci didn't deserve her 10.0s in the case that another hypothetical gymnast was better? Of course, gymnastics improved technically and had its artistic golden age in the 1980s (about 6+ years after she received the first 10.0s), but nobody looks back and says "they shouldn't have given her a 10.0 because gymnastics evolved." Instead they recognized what a revolution her difficulty + technique was and like that she made gymnasts realize it was possible.

 

[Sydney Rose]

Regarding the 10s: my issue with them lies in this way. Ten is the absolute maximum. So what do the judges do when Hanyu gets better (and I have no reason to think that he won't)? Where do they go from here?

Alternatively, you could view it as the judges saying, "It's no longer possible for you to get better".

I have this concern whenever I see a 10 on the protocol and I've long thought that PCS is now far too high - for everyone. There's no room left.

Where do the judges go from here? They do exactly what they would do under the old scoring system: Give him 10's again. Although 6's weren't common in the old days, they weren't that rare either.

And no room left for what? What merits a 10 for you? A skater who can take flight and not touch the ice at all?

For many of us, Hanyu is already Superman. I've watched skating for decades and he is in a class by himself.

 

[Mrs. P]

When I think about it. It's up to Yuzuru ( namely and others) to learn how to perform magical and well-choreographed programs with higher-tech content, consistency

I don't see Hanyu getting 49-50 at every SP unless he presents THAT kind of performance with similar (or even harder) technical content.

I think what the judges are saying, IMO, is "That was an awesome performance. Now go do it again."

Michelle Kwan got a lot of 6.0s (especially domestically) because she presented magical performances time and time again. Maybe Yuzuru can build a similar legacy.

 

[bramweld]

What happened to Chan? My word, you go to work and completely forget about the men and you come back to see this. I wonder if he'll stick it out. :sad21:

 

[Ophelia]

^It's one bad program. Too much overreacting. Chan will be fine.

 

[da96103]

Regarding the questions why Chan wasn't prepared for zayaking...

http://www.thestar.com/sports/skati...ing-sixth-out-of-six-at-grand-prix-final.html

Me thinks someone needs to be a more strategic competitor.

He probably could do that when he was still the World Champion after falling three times. ('That' meaning not well-versed with the rules.) Bu now is a whole different ball game altogether.

Now, with Yuzu breaking records, Boyang with a quad lutz and all male skaters edging their coaches to prepare their SP with two quads, you gonna need to get your points (or in Patrick's case, reduce your loss of points) in any way possible.

 

[xibsuarz]

What happened to Chan? My word, you go to work and completely forget about the men and you come back to see this. I wonder if he'll stick it out. :sad21:

He fell victim of the Zayak rule and a pop in a program with only 3 jumping passes but he's got nothing to lose so that may help him to perform better in the FS.

 

[Ophelia]

He probably could do that when he was still the World Champion after falling three times. ('That' meaning not well-versed with the rules.) Bu now is a whole different ball game altogether.

Now, with Yuzu breaking records, Boyang with a quad lutz and all male skaters edging their coaches to prepare their SP with two quads, you gonna need to get your points (or in Patrick's case, reduce your loss of points) in any way possible.

It boggles my mind that any competitive skater would compete for so long without memorizing the rulebook from front to back.

 

[Interspectator]

The Person in the Frog Costume seen in the stands has uploaded a Fan-cam of Yuzu's SP.
She was there last year too. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MI1PHanRiGU

 

[bramweld]

He fell victim of the Zayak rule and a pop in a program with only 3 jumping passes but he's got nothing to lose so that may help him to perform better in the FS.

Thank you. I was just surprised to see him at the bottom of the pile.

 

[Alba]

People act like the 1.0-10.0 scale on PCS is not relative to what the standard in skating is, but it really is. Otherwise, how does one determine "good" "great" or whatever terms are used in defining what each PCS score is supposed to mean. It has to be relative because it's quantifying qualitative and subjective things. It's not like a jump that's easily identifiable. I don't mind 10.0s if we get something that truly was out of the ordinary and rare and special in the the time the performance happened. If we keep playing a game of "what if something was better..." or trying to interject our very own ideas of the perfect routine with the perfect execution with the perfect skater only deserving a ten, then the 10.0 will always only be a hypothetical and unattainable. I don't think a scoring system should have any score that's unattainable. Extremely difficult to receive, yes, but unattainable, no.

I wonder how many people said that Nadia Comeneci didn't deserve her 10.0s in the case that another hypothetical gymnast was better? Of course, gymnastics improved technically and had its artistic golden age in the 1980s (about 6+ years after she received the first 10.0s), but nobody looks back and says "they shouldn't have given her a 10.0 because gymnastics evolved." Instead they recognized what a revolution her difficulty + technique was and like that she made gymnasts realize it was possible.

Spot on!

p.s. @All: It's not a criticism to anybody because after all, this is a forum and the purpose of this thread is to discuss all the aspects of competition but I'm really struggling to understand how can anyone who likes this sport feel the need even to mention the PCS that Yuzuru got in the SP. That was a MASTERPIECE! It was the perfect combination of great technique and performance. High quality written all over, and this is what FS is about!

 

[emma]

Wow. Wow. Wow. I have no other words for Yuzuru's SP - it was amazing 2 weeks ago, but this just left me speechless. Then, he was so darn cute in the Kiss and Cry; happy with his results and cheering on Javi (I loved the 'vamos Javi').

I hate to see Chan struggling like this; but he skating - like feet to ice skating - is really amazing. I enjoyed the program despite the problems. It's too bad javi couldn't "go clean," but that's a nice short program for him (first I'm seeing it this year as I've missed a bunch of skating thus far).

I'll just say with Hanyu upping the ante the way he has, and other men bringing out the second quad or the "hard" quad (as in lutz), while still others are pushing the skating skills/transitions elements- well, I'm just saying that I can't imagine the pressure these guys feel. It's truly stunning to watch this.

 

[rollerblade]

Headline news: Barcelona, SPAIN -- Scientists have been summoned to perform experiments on a male figure skater today, to determine if he is indeed a human. Results inconclusive.

 

[coucou84]

I want Yuzuru to get to 115 by the time I see this in person in March. #MakeithappenYuzuru. #Isthatevenpossible

Hahaa I calculated his maximum score with what he's doing now (with a level 4 step sequence because we all know he can) is a 113.65. With all +3 GOE, with a perfect 50 PCS. Meaning he was literally 2.70 points off of perfection (1.2 out of those 2.7 were on that step sequence for the base value and the factored GOE)

 

[Blades of Passion]

This competition was like the ultimate dream revenge.

Hanyu gets screwed over by the dumb zayak rule at Skate Canada and this time Chan gets screwed over by it...and loses the SP by 40 points. Forty. Points.

It's too much to handle. LOL.