Hip-Hop & R'n'B in FS

[Warwick360]

I Wish by Stevie Wonders.

But I wonder if that would be more jazzy soul.

 

[frida80]

What makes it R&B, other than a black person sang it?

Do you want me to explain R&B as a style or do you want confirmation that it was recomposed as an R&B ballad and defined by her and the musical world as an R&B ballad? I'd rather do the second since the first would derail the thread even more.

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

I thought for sure we'd get some Timberlake when vocals were allowed. Apparently he's got nothing on some POTO.

Speaking of Stevie.....can you imagine an if someone dared to give "They Won't Go When I go" a solid attempt.

 

[TontoK]

Do you want me to explain R&B as a style or do you want confirmation that it was recomposed as an R&B ballad and defined by her and the musical world as an R&B ballad? I'd rather do the second since the first would derail the thread even more.

Actually, I'm being very serious. Dolly wrote the song, and while she loved Whitney's version and said that she thought Whitney sang it better because of her range and power, I don't recall the music or lyrics being "recomposed." It was just Dolly's version sang with a lot more power, as far as I can tell. I actually preferred Dolly's version because it was more heartfelt. Opinions will differ, of course.

There is so much cross-over appeal to music nowadays "categorizing" seems unnecessary. When is Whitney Houston R&B, when is she a soul singer, and when is she pop? If she sang a country song, why can't she be a country singer?

I love all kinds of music with two exceptions. I do not like rap, and I do not like heavy acid metal. I'm sure it's probably an age thing, although we did have metal bands in my youthful days, but I didn't like them any better back then.

 

[cocotaffy]

Because there is a Plushenko for every situation, here you go:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LLOIQ1aLGjg

For the least patient, the hip hop starts at 1:34

 

[frida80]

Actually, I'm being very serious. Dolly wrote the song, and while she loved Whitney's version and said that she thought Whitney sang it better because of her range and power, I don't recall the music or lyrics being "recomposed." It was just Dolly's version sang with a lot more power, as far as I can tell. I actually preferred Dolly's version because it was more heartfelt. Opinions will differ, of course.

There is so much cross-over appeal to music nowadays "categorizing" seems unnecessary. When is Whitney Houston R&B, when is she a soul singer, and when is she pop? If she sang a country song, why can't she be a country singer?

I love all kinds of music with two exceptions. I do not like rap, and I do not like heavy acid metal. I'm sure it's probably an age thing, although we did have metal bands in my youthful days, but I didn't like them any better back then.

It's not how it is written, but the way it is performed. Country has a very distinct style in specific keys and a specific ways. R&B is the same. It includes styles of soul and gospel intertwined with also specific rhythm, keys, and techniques. I've had this discussion a number of times on the Glee board. The complaint there was that Amber Riley, an R&B singer, wasn't versatile because she sang all her covers, including songs that were not R&B, in an R&B style. Which is true, she did. It's what the show wanted her to do and it was her specialty.

But in the end it is R&B ballad. It's won like 8 awards in the R&B category. There are at least three articles that define it as a either a soul ballad or an R&B ballad. Whitney didn't change the words, but she performed it in a R&B style.

I don't think there anything wrong with labeling. Specifically with musical styles, considering how much history and culture goes into these styles of music. Country and R&B are to very distinct types of music with very different styles. As you've noted, both appeal to different audiences. Of you have the label, it invites you to learn more about musicians about that genre and how it came to be. I just took classes on jazz and music in General and it's amazing how much jazz has influenced all modern music.

Seriously, we've derailed this thread. PM me if you want to discuss this further. I don't think it's fair to the original purpose of the thread.

 

[mrrice]

Because there is a Plushenko for every situation, here you go:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LLOIQ1aLGjg

For the least patient, the hip hop starts at 1:34

That rocked my world!!!!!!!!! I LOVE PLUSHY.......I have never seen or heard about that clip before. Thank you for posting it. Isn't that secret garden during the first part?

 

[gkelly]

It's not how it is written, but the way it is performed. Country has a very distinct style in specific keys and a specific ways. R&B is the same. It includes styles of soul and gospel intertwined with also specific rhythm, keys, and techniques. ...


I don't think there anything wrong with labeling. Specifically with musical styles, considering how much history and culture goes into these styles of music. Country and R&B are to very distinct types of music with very different styles. As you've noted, both appeal to different audiences. Of you have the label, it invites you to learn more about musicians about that genre and how it came to be. I just took classes on jazz and music in General and it's amazing how much jazz has influenced all modern music.

Seriously, we've derailed this thread. PM me if you want to discuss this further. I don't think it's fair to the original purpose of the thread.

Actually, since the purpose of the thread is to discuss Hip-Hop & R'n'B in FS, I think it could be useful to define Hip-Hop and R'n'B, at least in broad terms, for those of us who may not be as knowledgeable about these categories as we would like.

Up to you, but I'd appreciate it if you are able to share your knowledge.

 

[frida80]

Actually, since the purpose of the thread is to discuss Hip-Hop & R'n'B in FS, I think it could be useful to define Hip-Hop and R'n'B, at least in broad terms, for those of us who may not be as knowledgeable about these categories as we would like.

Up to you, but I'd appreciate it if you are able to share your knowledge.

I'll think about it. But I hate derailing threads. It seems really unfair to the OP.

 

[StitchMonkey]

I am not going to try to label what specific genre music it is... but i think it could reasonably be fit in the broad umbrella family that is being discussed in this thread.

Malika SHARSHENBAEVA of Kyrgyzstan skated to this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5JAM3IVSsOI for her SP this year on the junior grand prix... and looked like she enjoyed every second of it!

 

[mrrice]

I have been dancing and a fan of skating, this has never been an issue. I guess with the allowance of lyrics this situation is something new. I don't know which category this song falls into but.......I'd love to see a Dance Team skate to this ballad by Stevie Wonder. "All In Love Is Fair" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OxNw9LmWq-E

 

[SarahSynchro]

Didn't Tara, Kristi and Katarina do a ridiculously bad rap number in Stars on Ice? I tried searching for a visit of it on YouTube but came up short.

 

[deedee1]

One of my all-time favourite: Hip hop Swan Lake by the star Daisuke Takahashi. This program should have deserved 10 for choreo and interpretation.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O4ItQq5q5x8

P.S. You can scream along if you like

I've checked into this thread, only to check whether or not doris has already clicked 'Thumbs-Up' bottun with nolangoh's lovely post.

As his big fan I'm not particularly in love with the program, but I do love the fact that Dai did it as a competitive program and Nikolai's undeniable talent full of ideas as the top choreographer; no one but Nikolai can think of using the music for a competitive program, and of course no one but Dai can skate to it and dance like that on ice! They together did stretch the boundary of competitive figure skating; such a step forward in the sport.

I still remember the SHOCK I felt and the FEVER among all the crowds when Daisuke performed this Hip Hop Swan for the first time that season at the Exhibition of International Counter Match Figure Skating Competition USA vs JPN (season-opening match, now it's called 'Japan Open'): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZuxAgWATuQ0
IIRC doris was among lucky crowds who witnessed when he skated it for the first time at actual competition; Skate America. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aRkdoLxPdD8

 

[Giselle]

The 2nd part of Hubbell & Donohue's FD last year.

 

[plushyfan]

That rocked my world!!!!!!!!! I LOVE PLUSHY.......I have never seen or heard about that clip before. Thank you for posting it. Isn't that secret garden during the first part?

This was his first appearance after the serious surgery. He had groin hernia on both side, he withdrew on Moscow WCH 2005 if you remember. He threw away the crutches and he was ready to win the Torino OG. His other gala number was totally different but no less excellent. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pr7HWxzjv54

 

[mrrice]

This was his first appearance after the serious surgery. He had groin hernia on both side, he withdrew on Moscow WCH 2005 if you remember. He threw away the crutches and he was ready to win the Torino OG. His other gala number was totally different but no less excellent. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pr7HWxzjv54

I seriously think Plushy should go into acting. He is so expressive, he's almost like a "Mime" when he does these show programs. I imagine after all his touring that he doesn't really need the money but, I sure would love to see him in movies. Illia Kulik was in that dance movie Center Stage and Plushy is certainly as talented as Illia.

 

[leafygreens]

- Not loving Malika's hip hop version. It looks too practicey to me.

- There's a girl who calls herself the Hip Hop Ice Queen:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YW3Y7kNO62k

- And don't forget the timeless Whip My Hair by Starr Andrews:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QBxpjtcBAG8

Didn't Tara, Kristi and Katarina do a ridiculously bad rap number in Stars on Ice? I tried searching for a visit of it on YouTube but came up short.

Yes they did I can't find it either. Here's a snippet:
http://www.illustremultimedia.com/tara-lipinski-•-hip-hop-on-ice/

Here's one with Yuka but there's no sound.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ib3LiKJmRWw

- In an article hilariously titled "Young Figure Skaters Allowed to Go Gangsta," regarding the new rule that hip hop is allowed for Junior ice dance, a skating official notes that "we do not want to hear any obscenities. Your coaches should check the lyrics."
https://www.rt.com/sport/hip-hop-gangsta-figure-skating-isu-minsk-601/

There were some ice dancers who did a hip hop routine, in junior competiton, but I can't remember who they were.

 

[glorybox6]

It's interesting that the skating official commented on obscenities re: junior ice dance -- I've heard a couple of words that some might consider obscenities springing up in a few programs this year--
-"Shows that we ain't gonna stand s***" in D/R's Hometown Glory (Adele)
-"Kept my d*** wet with that same old bet" - in multiple skaters' Back to Black (Beyonce)

I wonder if the ISU will clarify their stance on explicit language in programs at some point? Honestly, if the song is good enough, I'd rather hear the actual word than a big, distracting bleep noise, but I suppose there's a limit (multiple occurrences in the same song, more flagrant words, etc.).

 

[noskates]

Full Definition of hip–hop
1
: a subculture especially of inner-city youths who are typically devotees of rap music
2
: the stylized rhythmic music that commonly accompanies rap; also : rap together with this music


Rhythm and Blues music, or R&B music, was originally termed "race music" and basically included any form of music intended for black audiences. A combination of jazz, gospel, and blues, the term "R&B" was originally coined in the late 1940’s in the United States to be used as a less offensive marketing term.

Those definitions come from an online Webster's site and are a broad brushstroke of what both genres have evolved to. For me, rap music or hip hop is music that IS rapped to. R&B is soulful and bluesy.

Personally I wouldn't categorize Whitney Houston's IWALY as anything other than a beautiful ballad.

 

[Perdita]

There's ISU explanation of hiphop (for Ice Dance though):
http://static.isu.org/media/104308/hip-hop-2c.pdf