2016-17 GPF Mens SP

[Interspectator]

Agreed, Yuzu was a better performer, but i guess the argument for Patrick is that it is a skating competition and only a skating competition not a rock concert or gala. SO even though I preferred Yuzu, I can understand the scores.

I think the judges took that into account, Yuzu winning the IN, CO, PE portions and Patrick winning the SS and TR portions of PCS. By quite small margins though, so judges thought highly of both of them. Personally, I'd put Chan on top for PE and Yuzu on top for TR.

 

[Violet Bliss]

Chan's skating quality is excellent. But IMO he is not much of a performer---he is too inward-focused, almost as if he is skating to please himself, not the audience.

Hanyu was skating to Prince and in effect he became Prince and his program became a rock concert that played to and involved the audience. It was one of the most brilliant performances I have ever seen from him. And of course his technical skills are excellent, too.

This is your opinion and I feel otherwise. I get the joy and lightheartedness of Patrick's music and performance with the difficult elements woven in. The artistry is in every move, down to the finger tips. He floats on ice yet there is power in his skating and jumping.

Hanyu is incredible in being able to do the hardest jumps so nimbly and easily within a program of complex footwork. I see and am impressed by his talent but I feel nothing from his performances. He doesn't strike me as a rock star. Takahashi is a rock star. Hanyu is not. He skates as a boy, a very talented boy. Patrick skates as a man. (So did Takahashi, Browning, Lambiel, etc.)

Hanyu is in a class all his own as someone able to do the most quads, the highest BV programs, with great skating skills to do complex footwork and other moves in the field.

Patrick is in a class all his own as a true artist with the far superior skating skills, yet able to perform some of the hardest elements, with his BV competitive with the top few.

The current scoring system favours Hanyu's skills and even the young quadsters without his skating skills. To me his skating skills are at a level of a great triple jump whereas Patrick's is like an excellent quad. However, COP recognizes and rewards the difference between a triple and a quad jump but not the equivalent difference in skating skills and the maturity and sophistication of a performance.

 

[topaz emerald]

Hanyu.......please you cannot perform to prince!!!!

 

[semosk8tfan]

Performance of the day for me was Patrick Chan. It was everything I love about a skating program. And if you had told me a couple of years ago that I would say that about Patrick, I would have called you crazy. Looking forward to his free program.

 

[stella luna]

Patrick was my black bird tonight!

This is your opinion and I feel otherwise. I get the joy and lightheartedness of Patrick's music and performance with the difficult elements woven in. The artistry is in every move, down to the finger tips. He floats on ice yet there is power in his skating and jumping.

Hanyu is incredible in being able to do the hardest jumps so nimbly and easily within a program of complex footwork. I see and am impressed by his talent but I feel nothing from his performances. He doesn't strike me as a rock star. Takahashi is a rock star. Hanyu is not. He skates as a boy, a very talented boy. Patrick skates as a man. (So did Takahashi, Browning, Lambiel, etc.)

Hanyu is in a class all his own as someone able to do the most quads, the highest BV programs, with great skating skills to do complex footwork and other moves in the field.

Patrick is in a class all his own as a true artist with the far superior skating skills, yet able to perform some of the hardest elements, with his BV competitive with the top few.

The current scoring system favours Hanyu's skills and even the young quadsters without his skating skills. To me his skating skills are at a level of a great triple jump whereas Patrick's is like an excellent quad. However, COP recognizes and rewards the difference between a triple and a quad jump but not the equivalent difference in skating skills and the maturity and sophistication of a performance.

 

[Mrs. P]

Saw the top two programs. I enjoyed both of them very much. It was nice to see a contrast in styles. It's why I like the men.

 

[Violet Bliss]

Patrick was my black bird tonight!

:2thumbs:

 

[OS]

Rewatched it again, and it pains me to say this, but I actually don't think the 2nd half of Patrick's SP is that well choreographed musically. There's little acknowledgement of the music change which is really odd. Not sure if that is choreographer's fault or the performer. Personally, I blame the choreographer. There's no gear shift, mood change in the movement, so it looks like Patrick is still skating to Dear Prudence (which suited his overall ease and effortless approach much more). There could be a lot more interesting movements reacting to the strumming guitar string for example. Black bird might as well be some random background easy listening to classic Patrick Chan's skating movements. It is regrettable because these 2 songs happen to be among my favs of all time. It is not like Patrick did anything wrong, but Hanyu was obviously more inspired on the day (may be by Patrick?). His technical feat and energy suited Prince's black magic superbly. The Prince's song is so tricky unless the skater can 'will' some black magic in the air, it can fall flat (which was arguably what's went missing in its season debut), and it is always an unquantifiable X factor that didn't make sense until it happened today.

Having watched the 3 again, actually I thought Javier' has the strongest choreographic SP , but in terms of performance and actualisation, Hanyu knock it out of the park, while Patrick ticked all the boxes. If this is about style and substance, or inspiration and perspiration. Hanyu just inched just a tad with the style and inspiration, 0.25point against the master with his black magic. It is justified. I'd love Patrick break 100, but this is not a bad thing.

A perceived undermarked Patrick has a potential to be rewarded even higher during FS, especially I believe Patrick has the stronger FS program out of the 3.

 

[MIM]

I am back and watched men's event without spoiler!! Thank you @Pamigena.
Last weekend was so boring without a GP. I cannot believe we have no international competitions until Euros/4cc until next year I will make the best out of the GPF

Fernandez:
His 4T3T was gorgeous, along with Yuzu's 4S3T. How did he save the 4S? Watching his nose so close to the ice in real time, I was just amazed by his bodily control or cat-like reflexes in such a short second. The transitional entrance for the 3A was always on point, but his landing was not. The jump axis was too tilted to save and he fell. I was worried about his ankle. The following comb. spin was traveled; he still maintained the focus and charisma but his stsq felt off as if he wanted to move to the music, but his body could not catch up. I have not seen him this upset after the performance. Shortly after he was cheered at the KnC. But I kinda saw his dark, competitive side. His program is all about intention and charisma. I am not surprised his PCS is still said to be high. He tried to save all jumps and did not let loose regardless of the bumps during the performance. Respect! He will come back strong in the FS. I feel the vengeance.


Chan:
What can I say.. I loved it.

Beautiful skating Patrick... love the birdsong spring feelings 99.76 in first place :thumbsup:

Yep, I agree. It definitely felt like spring. His skating creates such a calm and tranquil, suave atmosphere on the ice.

Zueva really works well with her skaters arms. Can see it with Chan and Chen.

Brava Zueva! I am grateful her team, Epstein, for making his 3A stable and HUGE as well!! His 3A was as big as his 4T. I am super impressed!!

Hmmm, wait, are people here actually saying that Patrick was underscored??? Has hell frozen over?

Let's enjoy the ride. That is the effect of his clean skate. There is no better cure that diffuses the argument than Patrick's clean skate.

I saw some changes since the COC. First, he seems more engaged with the program, from time to time his focus is on the element only. But I will take that at the mid-season. 2.The FLYING sit spin is the best in the field. He literally flied to spin. He added new position, extending the free leg and twist his upper body with arms extended. 3. His Stsq got also improved, phrasing the music and lyrics profoundly; I like his whole body movement through twizle>counter>loop turn to the lyrics "Blackbird singing in the dead all night" 4. He also added arm variation to the layover camel spin.


Uno:
Shoma was heartbreaking. He is so giving. He almost fainted when he got out of the last spin. (plus, a thigh cramp??) The music is too serious. I understand that Japanese men are really into this music (i.e. Machida) but Shoma does not seem to add new layer to the music we already know. I think other music will be much more useful to show his musicality and sensitivity.

Those darker purple pants would look great on Yuzuru.

Right? I thought his shirt and pants together will be really good to Purple Rain.

Chen:
Nathan!!! It was the exact opposite from the last GP. He landed 4Lz (turn out) +3T, 4F fell, nice 3A!! vs. 4Lz fell, 4F+3T, 3A (shaky?) He is doing really difficult contents. I understand the jump errors. He has some nice and interesting spin positions, but having hard time maintaining the pose and getting a control. I like that he tries to skate big; sometimes, he looks frantic, but he is on the music and attacks all the time, which I appreciate a LOT! After Nathan fell on the 4F, he quickly got back to the choreo and hit the timing for the camel spin. I think he really skated his best here. If I see him better next time (at Nationals, or WC), it means he is developing real FAST!!

Rippon:
I was not sure until today watching him on HD feed that Adam actually uses his face a lot during STSQ. His edges got deeper. He seems more comfortable using his body + blade together in the steps. :thumbsup:
Did he actually check his nails (choreographically) before the final pose?

Hanyu:
Amazing! I listened to the TSL's NHK recap with Sandra Bezic. She said Yuzu has a sense of theater. I totally agree with her. I felt 100% then and now.
I see the same Hanyu when he does Chopin or Prince. He digest the music and program, makes it his own, and shares it with the audiences. He is a Rockstar but also feels like a boy next door. He knows what is expected in the program and did it 200%, which was nice pay back to the skating fans including Japanese fans who flied from far far away to see him (and others). I respect him as a person and how he can put together such a show without showing any pressure.


It was a good event. Skaters were well prepared and presented the best they could at the moment. Tomorrow is another day and I wish Best luck to everyone!

 

[NoNameFace]

Saw the top two programs. I enjoyed both of them very much. It was nice to see a contrast in styles. It's why I like the men.

I agree, especially is such good quality and clean performance frame. As I don't have a clear favourite among men (for me it's more of which performance or program I like better), I can totally appreciate both Partick and Yuzuru yesterday's performances - they both represent totally different style and 'take' on figure skating indeed, especially looking at the expression and 'volume of interpretation' presented - while Yuzuru is more intense, vibrant, dramatic for me, Partick is more of a subtle, subdued performer, but with same impact as Yuzuru, just getting it by some other 'tools'.

Moreover - both SPs are totally opposite: Yuzuru's dynamic, energetic 'rockstar' type of program, with quick pace, exuberant movement, demanding a lot of power and drive to carry on the performance alongside of Patrick's more reflective/nostalgic, lyric type of program, focused on little details, subtlety and portraying the story told by music which demands no less of skill to do it in convincing way.

I am glad that they both were able to present their programs without major errors, because it really enabled me to appreciate them equally, along with skaters' effort.

 

[Nocturne]

Agree. Chan has 'same ballerina' movements in both SP & LP with some jumps thrown in. They also happen to be the same old body movements for the last and previous years' programs. The 'performance' today between them are miles apart.

Well some people (like me) like this "same ballerina style" as you put it And people will always find different things better and thats good.
In think, for example, that Yuzus Parisiene Walkways was better than his Prince one. To me, they have rather the same style and I prefer Parisienne by far. I just dont like this Prince Song, especially the beginning music is so bad Not my cup of tea at all. But others my enjoy it.

 

[NoNameFace]

Adam should have gotten 4th. Uno has no business being on top of Chen and Rippon.

my impression is similar, based on performance Adam produced, and boy - he can produce A PERFORMANCE...As I love Shoma, his musicality and interpretation abilities, this was not his best day and Nathan is pleasant to watch, exciting, but still does nothing to me performance-wise (but good thing that he's visibly improving!), still try to keep in mind that BV thing and the fact that Adam had no quad, but performance -wise, expression and impact I'd have Adam also in 4th place - he just striked a pose like for Vogue and went for it, glad that audience was so positive in response. I get that there is this fake tan, sleeveless shirt, specific music choice, attitude...all this put alone is tacky as heck, but Adam somehow really makes it work and worth watching for me - for me, there is nothing artificial, forced in that SP, every move, pose, gesture, costume, even this friggin' fake tan go along with the music. I've had a party, a rave and a blast yesterday along with him and audience in Marseille and it felt GREAT.

 

[KwanIsALegend]

I am back and watched men's event without spoiler!! Thank you @Pamigena.
Last weekend was so boring without a GP. I cannot believe we have no international competitions until Euros/4cc until next year I will make the best out of the GPF

Fernandez:
His 4T3T was gorgeous, along with Yuzu's 4S3T. How did he save the 4S? Watching his nose so close to the ice in real time, I was just amazed by his bodily control or cat-like reflexes in such a short second. The transitional entrance for the 3A was always on point, but his landing was not. The jump axis was too tilted to save and he fell. I was worried about his ankle. The following comb. spin was traveled; he still maintained the focus and charisma but his stsq felt off as if he wanted to move to the music, but his body could not catch up. I have not seen him this upset after the performance. Shortly after he was cheered at the KnC. But I kinda saw his dark, competitive side. His program is all about intention and charisma. I am not surprised his PCS is still said to be high. He tried to save all jumps and did not let loose regardless of the bumps during the performance. Respect! He will come back strong in the FS. I feel the vengeance.


Chan:
What can I say.. I loved it.


Yep, I agree. It definitely felt like spring. His skating creates such a calm and tranquil, suave atmosphere on the ice.


Brava Zueva! I am grateful her team, Epstein, for making his 3A stable and HUGE as well!! His 3A was as big as his 4T. I am super impressed!!


Let's enjoy the ride. That is the effect of his clean skate. There is no better cure that diffuses the argument than Patrick's clean skate.

I saw some changes since the COC. First, he seems more engaged with the program, from time to time his focus is on the element only. But I will take that at the mid-season. 2.The FLYING sit spin is the best in the field. He literally flied to spin. He added new position, extending the free leg and twist his upper body with arms extended. 3. His Stsq got also improved, phrasing the music and lyrics profoundly; I like his whole body movement through twizle>counter>loop turn to the lyrics "Blackbird singing in the dead all night" 4. He also added arm variation to the layover camel spin.


Uno:
Shoma was heartbreaking. He is so giving. He almost fainted when he got out of the last spin. (plus, a thigh cramp??) The music is too serious. I understand that Japanese men are really into this music (i.e. Machida) but Shoma does not seem to add new layer to the music we already know. I think other music will be much more useful to show his musicality and sensitivity.


Right? I thought his shirt and pants together will be really good to Purple Rain.

Chen:
Nathan!!! It was the exact opposite from the last GP. He landed 4Lz (turn out) +3T, 4F fell, nice 3A!! vs. 4Lz fell, 4F+3T, 3A (shaky?) He is doing really difficult contents. I understand the jump errors. He has some nice and interesting spin positions, but having hard time maintaining the pose and getting a control. I like that he tries to skate big; sometimes, he looks frantic, but he is on the music and attacks all the time, which I appreciate a LOT! After Nathan fell on the 4F, he quickly got back to the choreo and hit the timing for the camel spin. I think he really skated his best here. If I see him better next time (at Nationals, or WC), it means he is developing real FAST!!

Rippon:
I was not sure until today watching him on HD feed that Adam actually uses his face a lot during STSQ. His edges got deeper. He seems more comfortable using his body + blade together in the steps. :thumbsup:
Did he actually check his nails (choreographically) before the final pose?

Hanyu:
Amazing! I listened to the TSL's NHK recap with Sandra Bezic. She said Yuzu has a sense of theater. I totally agree with her. I felt 100% then and now.
I see the same Hanyu when he does Chopin or Prince. He digest the music and program, makes it his own, and shares it with the audiences. He is a Rockstar but also feels like a boy next door. He knows what is expected in the program and did it 200%, which was nice pay back to the skating fans including Japanese fans who flied from far far away to see him (and others). I respect him as a person and how he can put together such a show without showing any pressure.


It was a good event. Skaters were well prepared and presented the best they could at the moment. Tomorrow is another day and I wish Best luck to everyone!

Yes, Adam did a quick nail check. It's humorous and shows ability to perform.

 

[KwanIsALegend]

Adam should have gotten 4th. Uno has no business being on top of Chen and Rippon.

He missed an entire HUGE required element. Not to mention not much of a connection to the music. But yeah, he gets ahead of Adam & Nathan. Makes perfect sense.

 

[da96103]

Patrick's program makes you want to go back and visit your parents.
Yuzu's program makes you want your parents to leave your house so that you can be alone and get crazy, unless if you are a young skating fan, then it would be YOUR PARENTS that want you out of the house so that THEY can be alone and get crazy.

 

[Li'Kitsu]

Yes, of course it was Max he was gushing on twitter too. The other one wasn't far off with his I cannot over Hanyu's 3A. They do love that jump, and the entry, and frankly I really appreciate it when they explain why it's such a difficult thing to do. They are also the ones that pointed it out when they spoke how with that he gets the same score as some others because the higher difficulty is often ignored.

And right?! They were all robbed and what's infuriating about the whole business is that not like their incompetence is new. This didn't just miraculously appear now. Thinking of Barcelona makes me cry and it's genuinely unfair. Fingers crossed for the LP, it might help it's also Saturday.

We can commiserate together over the Japanese. It's breaking my brain...:hopelessness:

Everyone who also loves Yuzu's 3A like that has my love! It's my single favorite move in FS since years, and in this SP, it's especially amazingly choreographed. And the Italian commentators really know their stuff technically. They're entertaining and knowledgable, among my favourite commentators along uncle Kurt! (Oh, I want a CBC Video of Yuzu's SP! )

It must be so depressing for the skaters... from what it looks like though, I'd think 4CC & WC seem to get good crowds coming, so there is that

(And yes, shared suffering is half the suffering, right? )

Hanyu is incredible in being able to do the hardest jumps so nimbly and easily within a program of complex footwork. I see and am impressed by his talent but I feel nothing from his performances. He doesn't strike me as a rock star. Takahashi is a rock star. Hanyu is not. He skates as a boy, a very talented boy. Patrick skates as a man. (So did Takahashi, Browning, Lambiel, etc.)

Really, a boy and not a man? The same BS we're reading all the time with the "woman between little girls" that also makes me want to tear my hair out - even if said woman is my own fave. Nothing but a weird pseudo argument for 'my older fave'.
Yes, Yuzu is very different from Dai, but a lot of 'rockstars' are very different from each other too (thankfully). What's so un-manly about Yuzu's skate? He has intensity, commitment and a command over the ice that few have. He also has more boy-ish cute looks and mostly lots of fun on the ice, but that's in no contrast to the former. I'd think there is plenty 'Skating like a man' in that SP.

And as a side note, Patricks BV here was not competitive with Yuzu's - he was around 7 points lower. That's a lot.

 

[nolangoh]

I admire Patrick's edges and fluidity but I never feel anything when he skates. His programs tend feel a bit too emotionally internalized, predictable and controlled, like all the energy and freshness has been buffed out of them.

Today Yuzu radiated emotion, spirit, energy, charisma and raw star power. He pulled the audience in, fed off their energy and then shot it back to them, magnified to a white hot intensity. He left everything on the ice. A full on rock star.

Chan's skating quality is excellent. But IMO he is not much of a performer---he is too inward-focused, almost as if he is skating to please himself, not the audience.

Hanyu was skating to Prince and in effect he became Prince and his program became a rock concert that played to and involved the audience. It was one of the most brilliant performances I have ever seen from him. And of course his technical skills are excellent, too.

Patrick and Yuzuru are two different types of skaters. Patrick is, yes, a more "introverted" skater who tends to let himself drown into the music and go deep with the music and perform the program "to himself". The "connection" with the audience is rather through emotion and perception, like his Chopin FS last season. That was a masterpiece. (Not for his bird-chirping SP this year though, just NO)

While Yuzuru, is obviously a rockstar, he excels at rock/pop music and his engagement with the audience was just popstar-like.

I adore both styles. I think both styles should receive the same merit. But it is a matter of taste after all

 

[viennaskater]

Can't speak for everybody, but a few things that kept me from going:
The location of the arena is less than ideal. The arena is less than ideal (e.g. you get a piece of plastic with no back under your butt and they call it "a seat"). Many people had trouble to even buy tickets because either the site was broken or payment wasn't accepted. The first tickets went on sale without prior warning around 3 in the morning (local time) and it was a public holiday in France, IIRC, so making any inquiries about the tickets was impossible. Not that anybody would have gotten an answer, because questions were rarely answered and unwanted comments e.g. on facebook simply deleted. The prices for gold category tickets were pretty steep. Category two tickets were still expensive, but came with the added bonus of unallocated seats. Happy hunting.

Can't really understand why they picked Marseille - Nice would have been a better choice of venue (2012 Worlds was held there and all went fine).

 

[dailytg20]

I was most impressed by Hanyu in this round. This athlete seems to reveal himself in layers. Every season he comes back with an upgrade, this time in the area of crowd-pleasing performance which is sort of devalued in the current system. He's come a long way from that asthmatic waif who looked like he just completed an ice bucket challenge by the end of his programs. It is amazing to watch his growth.

That loop landing was bananas. That kittenish nose crinkle he did after it reminded me of how Mark Ladwig recalled that he was more proud of the landings he was able to save than the ones he managed to execute perfectly. I was shocked not only by his determination to pull it off, but also by the way it drew my attention to the fact that those pants makes his butt look like a pair of freshly baked, generously filled anpan.

Nice job all around.

 

[MeineKatze]

Does Yuzuru deserve to get -2 GOE according to rules? and of course the Korean and Canadian will deduct the most points! such a coincidence rite?

Patrick's 90 degree bent body in his 4T landing gets +1 but Yuzu's 100 degree bend gets -2 ? for me the loop landed perfectly on outside edge but just lacked bit of speed on landing so I feel like -2 is a bit harsh for just lack of flow on landing