2017 Europeans Ladies FS

[silverfoxes]

I am optimistic about Anna catching up one day. She is still 18, and she has achieved a lot we thought was impossible... In 2014, many said she had the only and last chance to go to worlds and make to the podium but missed...If she can pull off backloading jumps

Yes, I think it was important for her to become more stable first and foremost. This season is (imo) about building confidence. I'm certain she will try to increase the difficulty of her programs for next season.

 

[andromache]

That is what she had been told the program was about by Averbukh. Blame him, not her.



And I will be laughing and whooping with glee. Slay, Moon Princess, slay!

I'm not interested in "blaming" anyone for anything, and I'm not offended by the program or Evgenia's interpretation. It's more about the judges - if the interpretation doesn't go with the music, scores should reflect it.

Isn't Evgenia's program in part about suffering though a life-shatterig event, but then picking up the pieces with a brave smile afterward?

I thought the story was saying goodbye to a loved one for a normal day, earth-shattering crisis occurs, chaos and panic because she doesn't know what's happened to the loved one, and then the phone rings with news (we don't know if it is good or bad).

 

[Tolstoj]

Evgenia Medvedeva -> speechless, she can't miss really. Another record is broken. That 3T after the 2a was just like "hey, i can do 8 triples without even caring if those are counted or not, because i'm the best", although i'm pretty sure she planned the 3S-3T-3T but the landing of the second toe wasn't ideal.

Anna Pogorilaya -> That gutsy performance proved in a way that she's the best from the russians: how hard can be to stay in the top, fighting everytime (because judges still don't trust her to give her so many PBs) and always making the world team in Russia, where every year there are always new talents coming from nowhere. She fought for those combos in the 2nd half, and actually very smart to do the 3 jumps combination with the loop instead of the lutz.

Carolina Kostner -> what a debut! Yes i knew moving to Mishin was a very smart move to restore every jump but here she fought for every single element: outside Sochi, i don't remember a competition where she landed every jump without doubling something. I think she is at her best shape possible, not to mention the program is beautiful, it suits her perfectly and the score is actually terrific because it gives her rooms to improve it a lot, adding one or two lutzes for example or an harder 3-3.

Masha Sotskova -> such a messy FS, and to me is the proof that yes, she is an amazing athlete and a beautiful skater, but not the new thing, the one that could spoil the podium.

Laurine Lecavelier -> yes, thank you! she was underscored in the SP, here i think judges saved her clearly because that half loop into the 3S should have been counted as a combination and that means no points for the 3ltz-1lo-2s. Nonetheless i'm so impressed how she's already improved since TDF, with a new clean 3ltz-3t combo, much more confidence. Pls don't be another Angelina Kuchvalska.

 

[largeman]

Wow, Carolina the Beautiful. Wonderful jumps and elegant skating. :luv17:

 

[jimini]

Or something like it. I feel like realistically, the 3A and the quads just aren't going to happen, not for a large majority of the ladies. So we're basically at somewhat of a stand still in the ladies division. When she does something like this, I am in favor as it shows that there is room for the ladies to grow. Not "up", in terms of quads, but "sideways", in terms of changing the rules and allowing more variables in combinations. I am also in favor of changing the rule, for everyone, where a 2-3 and a 3-2 are rewarded differently. It would help the sport for the ladies and when Zhenya does this, she is saying that yes it's doable, we can, and in my opinion, once the field opens up in this direction, others will start doing it too because it pays off. They won't bother now because they don't have Zhenya's cushion but they would if they got the points for it.

I 100% agree with this. I'd rather see more creativity in the current rules than ladies have to kill themselves trying quads. One of the biggest gaps in CoP/IJS has been that skaters aren't rewarded for the relative difficulty of combinations. There really needs to be combo bonus, kind of like how gymnastics has connection bonus. I wouldn't even mind a Zayak rule change if some day I can see 3T+3T+3T. Sure beats pointless 2Ts tacked on to fill all the jump boxes.

 

[Raomina]

I can answer that one, as I am one of those who is saying it.

Or something like it. I feel like realistically, the 3A and the quads just aren't going to happen, not for a large majority of the ladies. So we're basically at somewhat of a stand still in the ladies division. When she does something like this, I am in favor as it shows that there is room for the ladies to grow. Not "up", in terms of quads, but "sideways", in terms of changing the rules and allowing more variables in combinations. I am also in favor of changing the rule, for everyone, where a 2-3 and a 3-2 are rewarded differently. It would help the sport for the ladies and when Zhenya does this, she is saying that yes it's doable, we can, and in my opinion, once the field opens up in this direction, others will start doing it too because it pays off. They won't bother now because they don't have Zhenya's cushion but they would if they got the points for it.

I wonder if it makes sense to not count 1/2 loop combos as a 3 jump combo but a 2 jump combo instead (and not score the 1/2 loop), so that there's a greater variety of 3-3 jumps and more incentive to do another type of triple that's worth more, like a 3-3F combo. In ladies skating, the system is such that you need 3-3s to be competitive, so now you have a skater that's super at adding 3T's behind every jump. The difference between 3Lo and 3T is not big enough to risk getting a UR considering how much more difficult it is and, if I recall correctly, the value of 3T was increased for some reason, so there's even less of a reason to practice something else. Like, given that you can only repeat 2 types of triples, it doesn't make sense that repeating the lowest scoring triple should be such an easy choice to make.

 

[largeman]

I don't understand why people attack Zhenia because of an extra triple if she can do it, she does it. So?

I don't get it either, having read through the thread

All this fuss made about her invalid 3T which was inexplicably punished , yet no outrage over the ! call and +0.70 GOE she gets for her flutz: https://imgflip.com/gif/1ihy5o

Have people just accepted the fact that Zhenya will not get an e on her 3Lz and moved on?

(Although the panel was equally lenient on Anna's 3F so that's something.)

 

[Mathman]

I thought the story was saying goodbye to a loved one for a normal day, earth-shattering crisis occurs, chaos and panic because she doesn't know what's happened to the loved one, and then the phone rings with news (we don't know if it is good or bad).

Oh, that's brilliant. Thank you.

 

[100yen]

Oh, that's brilliant. Thank you.

At the beginning she goes to give her loved one like a briefcase or lunchbox but sets it down again because they are already out the door. Maybe the saddest part of the program is that very beginning piece because it's like she never got to say a proper goodbye...

 

[na1129]

So her interpretation has nothing to do with the music? Makes total sense. :sarcasm:

It is about how it is important to appreciate the time, people who are around you, because we live in a very shaky world where anything can be happened. This is not the program dedicated to just one tragedy.
Maybe this time, she might have gotten a phone call again that her lover has survived to a miracle!

 

[qwerty1195]

Welcome baaack Carolina!

In a sport where teenagers are dominating the spor,t it's so nice to see a veteran like Carolina to be on the podium and still compete with the best in the world! Sure, there's she still needs to work on her stamina and get her lutz but She.Deserved.Those.Components (personally would put her in front of Evgenia in PCS). You could also see how a good technique and foundation on jumps helps you a lot in longetivity and comebacks! She could just do an Ina Bauer and my heart is full! Worlds would be interesting...

Anna Tsareva's yuck face was priceless loool. Yas queen! <3
Anna P's FS was so gutsy like she has come so far I'm so happy and proud of her. She was so confident and managed to add her combo into the second half where in last season you could hear commentators everywhere saying "a very hard fall" or "ohhhh noo!" all the time. Also thought her PCS should be higher.

Evgenia is a beast. Her double axels are getting better imo and her jumps stronger. i think she's gonna be one of those who got lucky with puberty. Didn't really mind the extra 3T but I hope she gets better programs for next season. They're really not my cup of tea and the miming has to go.

 

[Seren]

I really loved this competition. Medvedeva is just incredible and her records are well deserved (and I say this as a huge fan of Yuna, Yuna moved the sport forward in her time and Medvedeva is doing it now). She was almost floating today. I was not on her bandwagon at first but she has won me over.

I was so happy about Anna's fight in this competition. She is my favorite Russian skater and I am so happy to see her consistency and drive this year. Even though it didn't all go right she fought for everything.

And Carolina is an artist. I am so happy to see her back and it is obvious that going to Mishin was a smart thing to do. I could watch her skate all day.

I can't believe I get to say this but this podium was perfect.

 

[SnowWhite]

The Medvedeva Machine rolls on. Yes, her programs are cheesy, but she is a charming skater despite the material she is given. If she continues on her winning path, she will be counted among the best of all time.

This pretty much sums up how I feel about her. Her programs aren't my favourites (though I don't have any strong dislike for them) and I don't connect as much emotionally as I do watching some other skaters, but I really enjoy watching her skate and I find her charming and very impressive. I would love to see her work with a different choreographer, but I can still enjoy her skating either way, even if she isn't my favourite lady (that would be Kaetlyn Osmond, both because I love her skating and because she's Canadian).

 

[Globetrotter]

The Medvedeva Machine rolls on. Yes, her programs are cheesy, but she is a charming skater despite the material she is given. If she continues on her winning path, she will be counted among the best of all time.

I don't blame Zhenya for her program. She is naturally a smiley, extroverted type performer and she does well. Her strength is she has the natural ability to reach out and engage with the audience and the reaction can't help but to make judges subconsciouslybecome more generous. Realistically in retrospect, does she deserve to earn PCS of that level? The program choreo was not balanced, the interpretation is suspect. Would you think her basic SS deserves CaroK and PChan type scores? I will say that she deserves perfect 10 for PE, high 8s for packing the transitions but her basic SS deserves at most high 7s to low 8s, CH is about high 7s and IN about mid 7s. Kudos though that she used her natural charm to max use although I hope she gets better music choices and program next season.

 

[Sweet Dream]

A bronze medal at the Euros is a very special gift for Carolina's return to the ice. Very glad to see that her joint work with Mishin is properly rewarded! Evgenia is still as solid as a rock. Very well done!

 

[Globetrotter]

By going with scores alone, Evgenia's SP + LP are the highest ever. The LP is also highest ever. I don't think those programs are in the top 50 best programs ever skated, let along the highest. The scoring system is really messed up. Evgenia's team deserves all the credit for exploiting the system to their advantage though.

I'd say her PCS are about 10 points too high. Her SS is not in the 9s if you compare her to people who have good skating skills. Her TR is ok, she does a lot of transitions, but they are still basic skills, not like Hanyu's or Patrick's transitions. Somehow she's getting transition score like the best men's.

CH is another ridiculous score. Those programs are just bad. IN is also bad. Only PE is deserved.

Basically 8 for SS, 8.5 for TR, 7 for CH, 7.5 for IN, 9 for PE. Don't know how they got everything 9+.

I have to agree although I will give her perfect 10. I disagree with the scores awarded in retrospect but can understand why. Zhenya has the ability to reach out as the performer which makes everyone happy and like it or not, judges are human and this emotional appeal at the subconscious level just make them only want to see the good things. This the high 9s. Realistically, is the basic SS that good? I rate it only high 7s.

 

[Krislite]

Nice to see Carolina Kostner skate again, and good for her to skate relatively clean even with a watered down technical layout. As for Evgenia's score, I can say I'm not surprised at the record. But I am amazed at how consistent she is.

 

[kevinVchicago]

SO PROUD OF LAURINE!
Wonderful!

 

[kevinVchicago]

Me too. Let the underdogs kick a**!

I loved Ivett's free skate! So beautiful. Can't wait to see her continue to improve over the coming years.

 

[Skater Boy]

Nice to see Carolina Kostner skate again, and good for her to skate relatively clean even with a watered down technical layout. As for Evgenia's score, I can say I'm not surprised at the record. But I am amazed at how consistent she is.

it is all proportional. Kostner doesn't deserve to be that close really with watered down content. Records shouldn't count. Every few years they change the rules and scoring system ie value of jumps, taking out elements etc. And the pcs have gone crazy since the new scoring sy stem began.