Women and the Quad

[Edwin]

More quads usually means lower components, especially TS. Down to near zero.

Yet, this program looks too much of Pluschenko style. Jump, plain run, combo, run, some rotation, run...
It worked well 15 years ago.

If only the audience could have the vote ....

 

[mrrice]

Even so, I think the other ladies on the Senior Grand Prix can go home now. :yes:

I agree. I sure hope Bradie heals quickly as she has a tough road ahead. With Alysa still being a Junior, the US needs Bradie to make an impact or we could go down to a single spot at Worlds. I sure wish I knew how Mariah was doing this season. Any word from her yet?

 

[starla16]

Trusova's FS

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3c4cmazhjrI

 

[Elucidus]

More quads usually means lower components, especially TS. Down to near zero.

No, in fact it's the opposite. Judges doesn't like too much gap between TES and PCS - so they tend to raise PCS accordingly. I don't see Sasha having less than 65 PCS in the beginning of a season - and thats's me being very pessimistic considering inflation tendencies nowadays. It's very possible that judges will be so impressed that she will begin her season from 70 at once. Nevertheless they can't limit her too much in seniors -and that wiill be more than enough to win everything and burn.. pardon, destroy everybody with her gargantuan dragons.. I mean TES
TS - you meant transitions? Eteri girls usually have so much transitions that having little less than usual won't even be noticed. Comparing to noneteri girls - she has tons of transitons stlll.

Yet, this program looks too much of Pluschenko style. Jump, plain run, combo, run, some rotation, run...
It worked well 15 years ago.

It's just blatant lie. Maybe it can be applied to quads part of her program - but everybody do it like this between quads. Later her routine becomes more difficult and varied. It has every right to be considered as modern choreo as everyone's else. You just forget how people skated 15 years ago.

 

[Mathman]

It will be very, very hard to beat the Quadster with her own weapons, but who knows what secret weapons her major competitors have in their arsenal? Aleksandra starts from zero, and there might be judges that don't like this abundance of quads and will look for every opportunity to mark her down?

They will seek but will not find. Mathematics cannot be denied. Those three passes alone start her out with a close to 40 point springboard. (30.5 in base value alone before GOE). And that doesn't even count the two triple Axels that she will have by Skate Canada.

More quads usually means lower components, especially TS. Down to near zero.

You mean TR, right? Down to 8.5 compared to 9.0 for a skater who actually does some. (Plushenko figured out that aspect of the IJS years ago and won the Olympic gold medal. Other skaters attended the 2006 Olympics not to compete, but to get Plushenko's autograph. )

 

[yume]

No, in fact it's the opposite. Judges doesn't like too much gap between TES and PCS - so they tend to raise PCS accordingly. I don't see Sasha having less than 65 PCS in the beginning of a season - and thats's me being very pessimistic considering inflation tendencies nowadays. It's very possible that judges will be so impressed that she will begin her season from 70 at once.

Then i wouldn't mind if Kostornaya begins with 77 and if Satoko gets 80.

 

[Elucidus]

Then i wouldn't mind if Kostornaya begins with 77 and if Satoko gets 80.

It's not gonna help them :confused2: PSC has a limit - TES limit is only a sky

 

[yume]

It's not gonna help them :confused2: PSC has a limit - TES limit is only a sky

No but al least it would be fair.

 

[LiamForeman]

I agree. I sure hope Bradie heals quickly as she has a tough road ahead. With Alysa still being a Junior, the US needs Bradie to make an impact or we could go down to a single spot at Worlds.

From now to the Olympics you have to assume that all three Russian ladies will be in the top 6 at Worlds. No more Samodurovas or Konstantinovas. The REAL deals. Then add Kihira and whatever Japanese phenom will come up, plus the Korean contingent. I don't think the US will see two skaters at Worlds starting next year. Alysa might get the only US Olympic spot in 2022.

 

[Elucidus]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KdgWUZP-pcQ
Anna Scherbakova's 4Lz at Test Skates warm-up
Also she said in interview that she trains 4F too.

 

[AlexRus]

I've seen Trusova at test skate alive and I did not see "no PCS".

 

[mrrice]

From now to the Olympics you have to assume that all three Russian ladies will be in the top 6 at Worlds. No more Samodurovas or Konstantinovas. The REAL deals. Then add Kihira and whatever Japanese phenom will come up, plus the Korean contingent. I don't think the US will see two skaters at Worlds starting next year. Alysa might get the only US Olympic spot in 2022.

For the sake of our ladies, I hope you're wrong. Other than Alysa, don't we have any juniors who are looking strong?

 

[lusterfan]

For the sake of our ladies, I hope you're wrong. Other than Alysa, don't we have any juniors who are looking strong?

To keep two skaters, the combined placement only needs to be equal to or less than 28. There aren't enough people to push the US that low. Besides, Bradie isn't exactly a pushover and top 10 is very realistic. Top 10-12 is realistic for Mariah too. Ting also has a lot of potential (whether she can harness it, we will see).

However, I do think you're right in that the competition level has risen dramatically. All 3 Russian ladies will be gold medal contenders. Throw in Elizabet and Rika, Kaori, Satoko/Mai/Wakaba -- anyone in the Top 10 nowadays could have easily been medal winners a few years ago.

 

[mrrice]

To keep two skaters, the combined placement only needs to be equal to or less than 28. There aren't enough people to push the US that low. Besides, Bradie isn't exactly a pushover and top 10 is very realistic. Top 10-12 is realistic for Mariah too. Ting also has a lot of potential (whether she can harness it, we will see).

Thank you for lifting my spirits...….

 

[moonkat]

More quads usually means lower components, especially TS. Down to near zero.

Yet, this program looks too much of Pluschenko style. Jump, plain run, combo, run, some rotation, run...
It worked well 15 years ago.

It doesn't have to be. As Yuzuru says, ya need a base to express the artistry.The greater the skill the more options you have to express your artistry. Trusova has the speed, energy , transitions, and jumps.

 

[LiamForeman]

Trusova: Her jumps look bigger and better and she's grown noticeably. As for her program, okay, it's not to my taste, but she does have excellent presentation with her entire body. She isn't jump, two foot skating, jump, faceography, jump. I would like to see more tension in her upper body and arms, but that's nitpicking. She's wonderful. She's an excellent skater as well as an excellent jumper. She clearly will win every competition just on her base value, and I hope she does leading up to Olympics, unless someone can match her jumps (Valieva, Shcherbakova, Liu). I can't see her losing anything this season. She's so strong.

 

[natsulian]

For the sake of our ladies, I hope you're wrong. Other than Alysa, don't we have any juniors who are looking strong?

We have a few: Kate Wang, Mia Kalin, Isabeau Levito, Isabelle Inthisone, Sarah Jung, etc... it's a matter of harnessing the talent. Bradie literally had the fourth highest score of all the ladies last season. If she continues to improve in the PCS department, a Top 6 placement is very possible. Also, the Ting, Alysa, and Hanna trio will certainly be interesting to watch. We saw what they were capable of at 2019 Nationals and all three can score VERY high, especially Ting, whom the judges love.

 

[Baron Vladimir]

Then i wouldn't mind if Kostornaya begins with 77 and if Satoko gets 80.

I'm not quite sure about that. In the free i marked Trusova 8.25 7.75. 8.50 8.25 8.00, in short i think all her components were 8+. For the comparasion i marked Kostornaia 8.75 8.50 9.00 9.00 9.00. (I marked Zagitova the highest in PCS at tests skates 9.00 9.00 9.25 9.25 9.25). And Miyahara would probably get 9.00 8.75 9.00 9.00 9.25 (or at her very best 0.25 higher) from me - (lack of) jumping ability is not helping her PE mark. Thats 65.2 PCS for Trusova's (not totally clean free), 70.8 for Kostornaya and 72 for Miyahara. Especially Trusova PE score can easily be on the level with those two, maybe only 0.25 lower. Because she showed energy, commitment and skated for the audience (you can hear their reaction to conclude why her PE score at least will be high).

 

[Edwin]

This thread is about quads, who are actually in competitive possession of quads this season?
We have seen Liu’s, Trusova’s, Shcherbakova’s, Akat’yeva’s?

Test skates being sort of open control trainings count as competitive for me.

 

[Shedi0806]

The ISU really needs to think about restructuring of PCS scoring so it could be more aligned with the technical. It has been an issue with the men and I think it will be more prevalent of and issue with the ladies as well. In the current system the TES outweighs the PCS so hard that it does not make sense for skaters to improve their SS, they have to jump well and they will win.

I would like to see that change so we could watch beautiful skating rewarded as well.