2017 Internationaux de France Free Dance

[keasus]

So, Olympic champs will be P/C... I love me some P/C, but choosing that music was a stroke of genius... it won't even matter how they skate to it, because it will be in their usual smooth style. Even without watching their program today I knew they'd hit 120... because they will win Olympics. It is known.

Can you also predict the winning combination for the next mega-million Powerball drawing? Now that would really be impressive

 

[keasus]

I can't tell who is hotter - Cizeron or his coach Roman.

Roman by a country mile. Did he recently marry his partner. or am I confusing him with another coach?

 

[4everchan]

I can't tell who is hotter - Cizeron or his coach Roman.

poje

 

[Ender]

Hummm Idk. We'll have to see how the judges react when they'll compete together, in GPF.
:

I think most people and judges are more impressed by P/C programs. And we know in ice dance, programs matter the most.

 

[Ares]

Stepanova/Bukin must go the same place Tarasova/Morosov go to find music. It's not possible to find music that is that cheesy...

Russians have their unexplicable penchant for cheesy music though, cheesy voiceovers or at least for what-the-hell music mash-ups. Bobrova / Solovyov Free Dance from their previous season with random Four Seasons jammed at the end, their SD music this season (I actually like it, my guilty pleasure ... so ... shshshsh ... ), Loboda / Drozd SD melodramatic telenovela + chipmunky song - exquisite combination. The list can go on ... and I only focus on Ice Dance.

 

[icetigger]

They did not add the vocals by themselves, and neither did anyone do it especially for their FD. If you looked at their ISU bio, you would see that the Liebestraum with vocals part that they are using is called 'Love's Dream by Rick Wakeman'. It's from a 70s movie called 'Lizstomania' for which Rick Wakeman did his own arrangements of several classical music pieces by Lizst and other composers. If you are wondering who this Rick Wakeman is, which you most likely are if you are not interested in/have no knowledge of classical rock music - he is a famous classical rock pianist and composer and one of the leaders of the legendary band 'Yes'. And the male singer on the piece is Roger Daltrey, the lead vocalist of another legendary rock band, 'The Who'. He was one of the most notable/best known vocalists on the rock scene at the time, so no wonder that Wakeman invited him to sing on this piece. Although I must say that he sounded better and different when singing together with 'The Who', and I have no idea what happened to make him sound like and old man with a trembling voice. Also, I don't know/recognize who the female singer is.

You mean it's from the soundtrack to the Ken Russell film. Now, that's hilarious!

 

[NoNameFace]

P/C are not a shoo-in at GPF because V/M THRIVE on competition. It is their strength: the do better when in competition with their main competitors. P/C are more nervous competitors (except when they don't have anything to lose like at Worlds in Helsinki for the FD).
So it will come down to experience and nerves.

I think that all teams thrive on competition, actually and Papadakis/Cizeron will go into GPF stronger than ever because of judges' response - and preference clearly shown - for their FD. They are feeling way more comfortable with their programs and performances this season and to be honest - I do not see them doing a significant mistake to loose GPF to Canadians or anyone else. SD - it could toss either way depending on levels, but whatever to be said now about OUR preferences, who is 'better' or 'worse' in SD, both teams know how to execute their stuff to get 80+ score now - and by this, Tessa/Scott's advantage is no longer in use points-wise. With FD - I'm sorry, but I'm not buying 'same competition' perspective, too much of gap shown in GOE and PCS in GP so far, judges clearly love Gabriella/Guillaume's FD as a whole: the picture of it created from every angle, regadless of competition, competitors, panels, countries etc.; its universal appeal is a force now that Tessa and Scott probably won't overtake - their 'Moulin Rouge' FD, response for it is good, but not as 'overwhelming' and unanimous as for French team.

Both teams are building momentum, respectively, but French team is building it in broader perspective, wider range, especially with their FD. That's my take after both teams competed in their GPs. And counting on others' mistakes is low, but with that trajectory it is what it is

 

[Roast Toast]

-snip-

Great post, I agree with most of it. My favourite FD of theirs is still Odduada/Stillness, I love the play on imbalance in that program, and for all the talk about them being "modern dancers" it really was the first time they committed to an avant-garde concept. However, it was very ambitious music to skate to, that left little room for missteps, and proved to be a strategic error, as they were very nervy every time they faced off against Tessa and Scott -- except at Worlds where I suspect they realized the point deficit was too large after the short and they relaxed.

This year their approach is clearly different. While last year they skated "on the defensive" (defending their titles against V/M, defending their FD concept), this season they are on the attack, with two programs that perhaps concede in raw emotion and personality in order to secure their levels. You can see it especially in the FD; usually they aim to disguise their technical elements within the flow of the program, but that is too dangerous when another team can receive similar levels AND execute more striking, individual elements that achieve higher GOEs like Tessa and Scott. As a result, they've worked in many "exclamation points" that highlight their elements a ton more: the creative exits out of the twizzles and the spin, the entries into the lifts, the placement of the choreographic spin and lift within the program. I think it's obvious that this FD is technically their highest achievement, even though emotionally I kinda miss the burgeoning creativity of their earlier programs. In an interview that was posted on the fan fest, Gabi called their approach this year "tactical". That's a good adjective for it.

I think it can only be viewed as a good thing -- it means they are maturing as competitors, which imo will eventually translate into them also improving as performers. They will learn to skate with similar abandon, except having raised their skill ceiling. And I am very happy to see them bringing in someone like Cirio, I can only hope they will continue in that direction in the future. It's customary on here to bash their similar stylistic choices, but speaking personally I love contemporary dance and I think there is as much variety and excitement in exploring it as in ballroom dance.

 

[andromache]

I still think their Mozart FD was by far their best and iconic.

I'd love to see how it would look with their level of ability now. Re-watching it in 2017 - they're far less polished, the skating skills are weaker, etc., in 2015. I kind of love how rough around the edges it seems in hindsight.

 

[Anyasnake]

Breaking out the scores ! I'll do top 5 and mostly the tech.

Papadakis/Cizeron :

Great twizzles, so fast and so much ice coverage.
Lifts : They're not far from maximum points on all of them (the 2nd one already is maxed out). I love how it's blending into the FD, they make sense.
The step sequences were incredibly fast especially the Cist which was level 4. They still have the other level3, which is a flippin' 1.5 margin that they can get. The edges were so deep and sweeping.
They maxed out on the spin too, I actually felt it was much better than in Coc.
I know, I lack criticism for that performance but that was so good I don't know what to say... sorry.
General impression :

Chock/Bates :

Lifts : 1st and 3st one amazing. 2nd one, a bit shaky by Evan on his spread eagle (nitpicking).
Mistake on the twizzles, one level down (3) and (-)GOEs.
Step sequences : They have a lot more flow than before, but not perfect (couple of glitches), and they could dig much deeper.
It seemed a bit off today ? However I'm so impressed by the lifts, it's acrobatic, but flowy, it's good !
Other than the twizzles, they are losing a hell lot of ground to the 2 US teams... But GPF is in the bag.
General impression : it's a very... "American" FD. It's building up, has a clear message, etc (You know what I mean haha). In this case they have to be powerful otherwise you may lose the viewer. But here and in CoC they went just after P/C and their WRs, that's not always an easy task.

Weaver/Poje :

It started so well with a big Cist4, which was very good. Their Dist was 3, so on the step sequences, they have to polish it because they could be much higher on GOEs, but levels are what you would expect seeing the top teams this season.
However they lost a lot of levels : on the spin (only 2) and the last lift (only3) and that is a huge 2.50 points missing. If someone knows for the spin, please tell me.
They were still way too hesitant on twizzles but they went through it successfully, however low GOEs for them (hesitant and lack of synchronisation).
Now another issue that I have : They got 8.93 on transition, their lowest PCS and only one under 9, and the judges were right. Some of them are sloppy. It is a program that requires to be frantic, but you have to avoid the sloppiness at all cost. it's not ony on transitions : sometimes on lifts, KW will just "drop" both of her feet on the ice and that is not pretty at all to see. They have their vehicle, they need to fix that ASAP, it took me away from the program a bit.
General impression : that was a good fight, but it happens, they were not at their best tonight. I actually want them now to take 3-4 days off and heal properly and then go back on full beast mode.

Stepanova/Bukin :

Their twizzles are so impressive, only the lack of ice coverage will keep them away from that perfect 8.40. But excellent.
Both step sequences at level3 which is good, they can work to make one 4 if they want to move up for that olympic season.
Their lift have a wow factor, they capitalize on being acrobatic, however the Rotational one is only level3, so something must be checked. (again if someone knows)
Some of their component are starting to reach the 9s (not yet but certainly soon). They have a lot of speed and can seem a bit controlled about their steps because of that at times, but once they find the balance between speed and control, they'll get bigger scores (and much better performances).
General impression : Their have incredible lines. They were very clean and for me I would have them higher than C/B and WeaPo on the FD. Absolutely ALL the elements were better... but PCS hold them down.
The music isn't shocking to me, since they actually skate really well. But, Ivan, get rid of that costume please. (Don't they look like Barbie and Ken ?)

Guignard/Fabbri :

Reputation scoring in the game !
So they got a nice BV, what you would need to be in the top 10, but low GOEs.
I've never seen them do step sequences like that. It was really good, you can see how much they've worked because some of it was just seamless (level 3 for both).
I thought their lifts were well done with good entries and exits (the last one could have been better on the entry but that is nitpicking).
Great spin and great twizzles, the latter being a bit underscored because along with P/C ans S/B, best of the night.
PCS honestly too low for today's FD. I know judges have their ideas but still...
General impression : I didn't think I could be blown away by them. It had a lot of great moment in the choreo, detailled, nice touches an it was refined. I'm not used to see them perform like that, but that was worth way more than a 101. Bravo !

Remarks :
-P/C still have a 1.5 margin and got a perfect 10 for IN.
-WeaPo and C/B have a 0.01 difference in PCS
-S/B with 2 3rd place are making their case to go to the Olympics and frankly it would be a mistake if they don't.
-Judge me all you want, but G/F have better edges that C/L. C/L have a great performance ability, but if you take out the upper body, they are lacking a bit on SS compared to some.
-I don't know if it's possible for C/B to catch Shibs and H/D now.

 

[icekiwi]

In my opinion, Chock and Bates seemed to have gone backwards since teaming up with Rohene Ward (what has he got to offer for ice dance??) and Christopher Dean (Dean's programs don't suit them, last year's FD to Queen was loud and choppy).

This FD is so boring choreographically, their old Rachmaninov's choreographed by Antonio Najarro and Igor was much superior than this. The SD is not any better, costume is trashy and again the lack of incorporation of actual Samba moves into the skating except when the skaters are apart.

If they want to continue in the sport post Olympic, they need to reinvent themselves, get rid of Rohene/Dean, work on basic skating skills, getting flowy deep edges in their repertoire, then they can set themselves apart. Right now, it is 3rd place at US Nationals and possibly 6th place at GPF.

 

[Alba]

Looking back though, they were very unpolished in that program compared to now. Their precision and consistency have increased dramatically since then, each small move with more impact. I personally liked their 15-16 FD the best.

Well, I would hope so. That's natural, otherwise it would mean they remained at the same level they were 3 years ago.
Still, that has nothing to do with the program per se, which remains their best and one of the best in the history of ID.

 

[blancanieves]

I didn't say they got a medal; they got 9 points for 4th. It's not true that the GPF is open only to those who win 2 medals; if that were the case, there wouldn't be a standings table that keeps track of points awarded down to 6th place in dance.

So, yes, if they somehow won 1st at SA, they would have 24 (9 + 15). In that case, the combined score tiebreaker wouldn't even come into play because the 1st-place finish (highest placement) is the first tiebreaker. Total points is second.

Oh, I see a first placement would take precedence over second. That's right, but generally the likelihood of making the final without making the podium at both assignments is very low.

 

[Skater Boy]

I think it is clear gold belongs to the FRench even with an error.I refer their lyrical style over V and M I just believepcwise - transitions, interpretationandall V and M deserveto be ahead but if the French are getting 10 for interpretation alrready V and M might as well just give up. This reminds me of 2014 - it was clearD and W were going to win.

Weapocameback but not enough to little too late. Now they risk falling out of the top ten.Here is ateam that was on the edge of world tile- fraction of a point to the edge of not being in the top ten. French lookgreat, Chock and Bates gotsilver but hardly dominant. Stepanova and Bukin beat Weaposo not bad at all for them.

 

[cell]

Charlie White sounded a bit harsh on C/B's performance?

 

[keasus]

You are a lot more generous to Step/Buhk than I am. Stepanova can strike a pretty pose and she is gorgeous, but her skating skills are nowhere near any of the top female ice dancers. Buhkin is dragging her around the ice. I know that this will probably be Russia's #1 ice dance team in the next quad, but I find it hard to believe that another younger/newly senior Russian team can't outskate them at least on technical components.

 

[Roast Toast]

I disagree, I think the comparison with 2014 is flawed. Tessa and Scott look much more confident and fit and, you know... they are also getting 10s in IN While a single point of difference in PCS in two different competitions/fields is apparently enough to warrant much wailing and gnashing of teeth, I for one expect them to tie in PCS score when they go head to head. It's what happened in both segments at worlds despite 1. V/M's short being much better and 2. V/M's stumblefall in the free. If it comes down to levels, then they have the advantage in the short where they more consistently max out their levels. Maybe a comeback is possible in the free but V/M's 117 last time was a fluke imo. So right now for the GPF I would still give an edge to V/M. Of course, the Olympics is another story, because the judges will go crazy with levels and 10s.

 

[Barb]

Charlie White sounded a bit harsh on C/B's performance?

I don´t know what he said, but that program looked a lot better in China.

 

[Purv]

think P/C are getting better at their performances--Gabby's pretty consistent about performing, but Guillaume has just clicked into gear--so now there's an emotional aspect to the his performance. This time, Moonlight Sonata seemed to be portrarying some sort of angsty love affair, but not in a trite way, but in a way that's connected to the music.

Poor Weaver/Poje. They more than anyone else were slammed by the reappearance of Virtue/Moir.

I'm now thinking that P/C might have a slight edge over V/M as far as judging preferences go. V/M are looking a little hackneyed

 

[crankyintheAM]

I've fallen completely in love with P/C FD this time. That was such beautiful, pure skating. Wonderful!

I've never been a fan of C/B, but they used to really bring it performance wise, but lately there's seem to be something off. Maybe it's the programs? They seem quite empty and Madison's skating seems shallower, I know she was never the best but it looks more noticeable now. Again, maybe it's because the performance is not grabbing my interest.

Sometimes I look at S/B and I see so much potential, maybe they could be pretty great if they spend a season in Canada?