2018 Worlds Ladies Short Program

[qwertyskates]

Agreed that frantic is supposed to be what is expressed, but you can do frantic movements that are still finished properly. She does not.

Um....definition of frantic in dictionary = conducted in a hurried, excited, and disorganized way.

So yes, she is meant to look "rushed", "unbalanced", she cannot hold aesthetic "finished" positions because it would defeat the nature of that stsq.

I'd argue that it is also more difficult to do and express than a beautiful, aesthetic, coordinated but quick movement, like say, a charleston.

Balancing while performing off-balance, off-kilter steps and uncoordinated movement is very hard - in dance in particular, there is a natural flow to movement that the body "wants" to execute which helps one to stay in equilibrium.

 

[Ziotic]

In the SP, Alina is meant to flail, it is reflecting a state of mental chaos to discordant music.

Back to the discussion, Caro did a lot of changing steps and positions for her stsq as well. So difficulty as judged = more changes in body positions

Um....definition of frantic in dictionary = conducted in a hurried, excited, and disorganized way.

Go look at Yu in pairs, maybe that will help you understand how movement done well looks.

 

[qwertyskates]

Go look at Yu in pairs, maybe that will help you understand how movement done well looks.

She's doing a gentle ballet...Swan Lake...:disapp:

When Alina performs a slow, pensive piece one day, let's get back to this discussion, K?

 

[kimi492]

I’m sure Alina will 99% still win, but it would be the gag of the year if Carolina could somehow pull off a gold. I would literally die

 

[Spirals for Miles]

I would too. Of unhappiness. For Alina.

 

[colormyworld240]

I personally think basically everyone is marked too high in PCS.

Also I don’t think Alina is a 7 in every category. I just find her very junior in say for example interpretation, she doesn’t feel the movements or understand the theme of her SP. She is simply executing moves as taught to her. She’s also 15 so I wouldn’t expect a deeper understanding of what she’s trying to portray. Her face is basically blank or she looks nervous or like she’s focusing on the next element.

Another example I could make is Kailani. I think she, in her best performances, would deserve high marks for performance maybe 8.5-9 as she is giving it everything she has. O don’t think that means that her SS are 8.5-9 worthy. But the judges all corridor judge and use the PCS as a 6.0 judging tool.

I don't understand why you say she has a blank face? I don't see a moment in which it is blank in her entire SP. You can see her transition into the black swan from beginning to end as the movements becomes more frantic and her expression changes. Maybe if you pause on her face in the middle of a jump. But through the choreography, she varies emotions in her movements but more-so her face. And she definitely has a deep understanding of her program, and I think her performance clearly shows that she does. I just don't understand why certain people keep saying she doesn't understand or doesn't skate to her program to the music. I can agree with her not having the best skating skills, and the frantic movements (though I don't see a problem with that, I however do want her to hold that Charlotte longer and stop bending at the waist during her crossovers), but I just can't see why people have issues with her performance and interpretation.

 

[Tolstoj]

I’m sure Alina will 99% still win, but it would be the gag of the year if Carolina could somehow pull off a gold. I would literally die

I mean why? it's up to them at this point.

If Carolina wants the gold she has to skate clean and maybe even dare to add a 3-3 in the free skate, judging here is on her side for sure.

At the same time Alina just has to skate clean, considering the difficulty of her program, that would probably be enough.

If Caro gets the gold, it wouldn't be a disaster necessarily since Alina has the gold medal at the Olympics which is the most important, and it would be the best way to celebrate Carolina's skating which is art.

 

[sweetice]

I don't think that Caro has really a chance to take the gold. Even with Caro's PCS, the judges and the crowd for her, Alina's BV on the FS is too high.

About her performance in the SP, we can discuss about the points all we wants but, at least to me, the first place was clearly deserved, for what we have see.

 

[qwertyskates]

I don't understand why you say she has a blank face? I don't see a moment in which it is blank in her entire SP. You can see her transition into the black swan from beginning to end as the movements becomes more frantic and her expression changes. Maybe if you pause on her face in the middle of a jump. But through the choreography, she varies emotions in her movements but more-so her face. And she definitely has a deep understanding of her program, and I think her performance clearly shows that she does. I just don't understand why certain people keep saying she doesn't understand or doesn't skate to her program to the music. I can agree with her not having the best skating skills, and the frantic movements (though I don't see a problem with that, I however do want her to hold that Charlotte longer and stop bending at the waist during her crossovers), but I just can't see why people have issues with her performance and interpretation.

I agree with you except if she holds the charlotte any longer then we won't get to see that PERFECTLY timed, exquisite split jump at that highlighted note right before the 2A.

 

[kimi492]

I mean why? it's up to them at this point.

If Carolina wants the gold she has to skate clean and maybe even dare to add a 3-3 in the free skate, judging here is on her side for sure.

At the same time Alina just has to skate clean, considering the difficulty of her program, that would probably be enough.

If Caro gets the gold, it wouldn't be a disaster necessarily since Alina has the gold medal at the Olympics which is the most important, and it would be the best way to celebrate Carolina's skating which is art.

LOL gag is a good thing - I meant die as in die of excitement - Carolina somehow pulling off being a ladies world champion at 31 would be legendary

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

LOL gag is a good thing - I meant die as in die of excitement - Carolina somehow pulling off being a ladies world champion at 31 would be legendary

I think it would be an awesome story but I’m going to throw in that I hope it’s not after a poopy performance. Is that really too much to ask

 

[kimi492]

I think it would be an awesome story but I’m going to throw in that I hope it’s not after a poopy performance. Is that really too much to ask

I’d say it’s a guarantee - Carolina will have to have the skate of her life

 

[gravy]

Judge 2 (Ms. Catherine L. TAYLOR) gave all 10s to Carolina

I am Ms. Taylor.

 

[Lester]

Alina can definitely skate Caro's program, but if she does it, she will NOT win, as she will not be maximizing her TES potential and she will always lose to Caro in PCS.

This is why Alina HAS to up her levels with more difficult, packed content to make up for her PCS disadvantage.

What PCS disadvantage? Her PCS are almost the same as Carolina's and Satoko's.
See, for me it would make sense to establish yourself as a complete skater first and then aim to win, but in this case Olympic gold was on the line in her first senior season, so I understand the rush to get all the points.

 

[Spirals for Miles]

I am Ms. Taylor.

Wait, what?? Really??

 

[qwertyskates]

What PCS disadvantage? Her PCS are almost the same as Carolina's and Satoko's.
See, for me it would make sense to establish yourself as a complete skater first and then aim to win, but in this case Olympic gold was on the line in her first senior season, so I understand the rush to get all the points.

Without overwhelming difficulty in the content of her programs, her PCS won't go up as quickly. especially for TR, CH.

She needs to skate a much more difficult program than Caro to win.

Caro can get super high GOEs just for landing a jump, Alina has to tick all the visible and obvious GOE boxes, tanos, transitions into jumps, in order to receive higher GOEs.

Either hundreds of judges are all bribed and colluding or Alina truly deserves her gold.

This is how she has been winning and as she nails each win, her reputation is established and her PCS rises so she can win over veteran skaters like Osmond and Caro.

She is skating the most difficult program of all the seniors in the field, spectacularly, consistently, more consistently than every top skater except for Evgenia and Satoko.

I believe she will add Worlds to her grand slam debut, and I look forward to it after her OGM.:agree:

 

[sweetice]

Choi has withdrawn due to equipment failure

 

[Globetrotter]

Is Orser being funded by Canadian Government? Is he getting free ice time from the gov / fed?

Same as that Mishin’s training of CaroK is not funded by public funds.

 

[Globetrotter]

Again, I don't see how she does not feel the music? She shows plenty of emotion in her face and movements. I didn't see that at the beginning of the season but I definitely see it now. I'm just wondering how she can "feel the music" more - what more emotions can she show? Other than slowing down the movements and yes being out of sync here.

Her skate is like a very hardworking student who reproduced what she was told. She is very young and it shows. My main take was more on that she was getting such high PCS scores despite being more rushed and playing catch up. It is only fair that skaters be scored for what they executed and not based on what they previously did. If it’s up to me, the overall PCS has gone ridiculously high for all the top skaters. Very very few are deserving of 9s. Exception is for Zhenya and clean Kaetlyn in PE, Satoko in IN. CaroK May have the best SS among active ladies but even that should not be getting 9s unless the blade mastery of PChan or Yuka Sato is shown.

 

[moriel]

Same as that Mishin’s training of CaroK is not funded by public funds.

Umm no. Most of Mishin activities are funded by russian government. The rink where he coaches belongs to russian government. Like, you know, he is employed by russian government and Caro is a freelance side job for him.
Is Orser employed by Canadian government?