Big interview with Tamara Moskvina for TSL

[Mariott]

Tamara Moskvina, at the age of 82, continues to coach at the highest level. Her views and experience are relatively unrivaled in the world of figure skating. Dave Lease decided to talk to Tamara Nikolayevna to find out her views on changes in the sport, the importance of ballet, the usefulness of figures in the development of figure skaters, the Kamila Valieva doping case and Russia's isolation from the global sporting world.

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[icewhite]

Definitely not the interview I expected.
I usually don't like to watch video interviews, but I guess I'm too intrigued by this combination.

 

[lariko]

Interesting that there is a fairly large segment about Gumennik. Heh, Moskvina seemed surprised to talk about single skaters, but she is game.

 

[Ic3Rabbit]

Can anyone please sum up this interview for those of us who can't watch.

 

[lariko]

Can anyone please sum up this interview for those of us who can't watch.

Moskvina quite politely and firmly told Lease that everyone should just do their job. She coaches, ISU and judges decide on things like alowing Russia to compete or value of 4A, and he, Lease, if he wants to know anything about Valieva or Mishina, he should call them, not Moskvina (since he is a journalist after all). She also side-eyed Lease's habit of holding his finger to his mouth, lol. Proper behavior was a reoccurring theme in her descriptions of training when it comes to athletes.

She talked a lot about following and learning from everything in the field and adjacent sports and art, like ballet, gymnastics (all types); underscored the importance of package (music, atletics, and behavoir) and competing package vs package, not country vs country. She laughed about retirement saying that she sees no sense in retiring from doing what she loves. Said that she trains M/G about 4 hours per day on ice. That B/K are their students and their children in sport, so of course she wishes them every success and cheers for their growth. She was very complimentary about Hanyu when Lease brought up his 2 hour show, and Lease promised to send her the recording since she didn’t have ability to watch it. There was a piece of music Lease mentioned that Moskvina said she likes the idea of using and thanked him for the suggestion, Legends of Love. She also told him she is only involved with packaging and psychological aspects of Gummennik training so couldn’t really convey Lease's suggestion that Gumennik skates a program like Nureyev.

One thing I didn't know was that Moskvina did Bielman first, taking the move from artistic gymnastics and adapting it to spin; it doesn't really bother her that Bielman adopted it and it was named after her, because she was 22nd or whatever in that competition and Bielman was the winner.

Her favorite FS moves are creative variations on the existing spins and positions, rather than one specific move.

In the end she emphasized that she loves figure skating as a sport, in all countries, and good athletes everywhere. Lease asked her to say it in Russian.

In other words, she stayed firmly to her principle not to spin rumors or comment on anything that doesn't immediately concerns her, and would talk shop, but not politic or criticize anyone. I think if Lease wanted that, he should have found Tarasova or Rodnina, lol

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

Yep, That is an excellent summary @lariko. Moskvina, the Magician and the ever skilled wise diplomat. Would that I might be as active, wise, humble, perspicacious, and bada$$ in my 80s!

One additional highlight for me is the discussion about figures. Lease has discovered the benefits of figures. He has been learning figures in Lake Placid under the tutelage of Karen Courtland (one of the founders of World Figure and Fancy Skating, which holds annual competitions, in their admirable mission to preserve the foundational art of figures) and Shepherd Clark, a former U.S. men's competitor, and a five-time overall champion and multiple medalist in various disciplines at World Figure and Fancy Skating Championships. Lease has also been taking skating lessons (which he posts on YT) from the amazing Paul Wylie (1992 Olympic silver medalist) and the exquisite JoJo Starbuck (a legendary U.S. pairs champion with Ken Shelley).

Moskvina did not have too much to say about figures at first. She seemed to feel that simply practicing the blade maneuvers, like rockers, that are used in training and competing figures, should be sufficient for current skaters. Perhaps Moskvina did not sound overly enthusiastic about figures because the ISU has eliminated figures from competition, and she as a coach, moved on and made adjustments with salvaging certain maneuvers used in figures for their students to practice. Still, once Lease expressed how much learning and practicing figures has helped his skating, in terms of increased speed and blade control (i.e., improved skating skills), Moskvina agreed that figures practice can be beneficial in those particular aspects. Indeed, Patrick Chan's wise coaches made him practice figures! Hmmm, 'nuff said!

 

[lariko]

I think Moskvina is all about specificity, training what actually gets performed in a competition. She was a little tight-lipped about what her skaters do to prep and also when Lease asked her about the number of run-throughs. She also underscored necessity of an individual approach to training/technique for each individual athlete, speaking against cookie-cut approaches to what to train on each day, how to jump--in other words, if the jump is landed, the jump is landed, so every skater does what they have to, to accomplish successful landing, be it jumping from the leg or helping with the upper body. Overall though, she wasn't at all enthusiastic about figures as an approach.

 

[Skating91]

It was a good interview until Dave went after the child again. It's got to stop. It's a poor reflection on his character to target a child in this way for approaching two years.

Surely he understands the difference between an explanation for how something possibly happened at a hastily convened hearing with 12 hours notice versus any explanation offered after months and months of a thorough investigation.

 

[SunnyCA]

Moskvina is such a legend and she knows how to give informative and interesting interviews without stirring things. Quite a surprise to see her on TSL given its rather scandalous reputation. However, she probably decided that it was worth it.

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

Moskvina is such a legend and she knows how to give informative and interesting interviews without stirring things. Quite a surprise to see her on TSL given its rather scandalous reputation. However, she probably decided that it was worth it.

Lease is fairly adept at interviewing. Plus, he has a good rep with some Russians who have appeared on his show for interviews, including Zakarian, Elena Bechke, and a Russian journalist named Maiya (can't recall her last name). Lease has also interviewed Olympic medalist and Ukrainian-born skater, Oksana Baiul. I do not think any of this swayed Moskvina in the least, because she makes up her own mind. But surely, these connections do not hurt. Lease has been landing great interviews with a number of top people in the sport, even without Jenny Kirk's help, for a few years now (including Igor Sphilband; Linda Fratianne; Caryn Kadavy; Katia Gordeeva; Dorothy Hamill; Paul Wylie; Romain Haguenauer; Adam Rippon; Debi Thomas and Shepherd Clark; Tracy Wilson; Brian Orser; Kurt Browning; David Wilson, et al). Lease and current cohost Jonathan, have also interviewed Kirsten Moore-Towers; Soucisse/ Firus; and Vanessa James & Morgan Ciprés, a year or so prior to their retirement.

A top ally of Lease whom he's also interviewed, is Sandra Bezic. It helped build TSL's prestige many years ago when Jenny and Dave interviewed Michelle Kwan, and especially their stellar interview with legendary coach, Frank Carroll. In the early years of TSL, there were interesting interviews with Tai Babilonia, Timothy Goebel, Debi Thomas, Meagan Duhamel & Eric Radford, Deanna Stellato & Nate Bartholomay when they first partnered, et al. There was a lean period when Lease's snarky rep had him in the doghouse with U.S. fed, and Jenny left the show as a regular cohost. But Lease rebounded with dogged dedication, and the support of Bezic and diehard followers. Lease and Jonathan tend to ramble too much, name drop, and make unclear references. Yet, it appears to me that Lease has mellowed a bit and he's become less snarky and more professional in his approach.

TSL's review of the European championships is posted on YouTube or currently in premiere progress on YT.

 

[icewhite]

Lease is fairly adept at interviewing. Plus, he has a good rep with some Russians who have appeared on his show for interviews, including Zakarian, Elena Bechke, Oksana Baiul, and a Russian journalist named Maiya (can't recall her last name). I do not think this swayed Moskvina in the least, because she makes up her own mind. But surely, these connections do not hurt. Lease has been landing great interviews with a number of top people in the sport, even without Jenny Kirk's help, for a few years now (including Igor Sphilband; Linda Fratianne; Caryn Kadavy; Katia Gordeeva; Dorothy Hamill; Paul Wylie; Romain Haguenauer; Adam Rippon; Debi Thomas and Shepherd Clark; Tracy Wilson; Brian Orser; David Wilson, et al). Lease and current cohost Jonathan, have also interviewed Kirsten Moore-Towers; Soucisse/ Firus; and Vanessa James & Morgan Ciprés, a year or so prior to their retirement.

A top ally of Lease whom he's also interviewed, is Sandra Bezic. It helped TSL's prestige many years ago when Jenny and Dave interviewed Michelle Kwan, and especially their stellar interview with legendary coach, Frank Carroll. In the early years of TSL, there were interesting interviews with Tai Babilonia, Timothy Goebel, Debi Thomas, Meagan Duhamel & Eric Radford; Deanna Stellato & Nate Bartholomay when they first partnered; et al. There was a lean period when Lease's snarky rep had him in the doghouse with U.S. fed, and Jenny left the show as a regular cohost. But Lease rebounded with dogged dedication, and the support of Bezic and diehard followers. Lease and Jonathan tend to ramble too much, name drop, and make unclear references. Yet, it appears to me that Lease has mellowed a bit and he's become less snarky and more professional in his approach.

TSL's review of the European championships is posted on YouTube or currently in premiere progress on YT.

Oksana Baiul Russian?

 

[lariko]

At least he is trying to hear what Russians have to say, if anything.

 

[Magill]

Oksana Baiul Russian?

Yeah, let's make it clear. Oksana Baiul is Ukrainian. First OGM for independent Ukraine in any sport.

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

Oksana Baiul Russian?

Right. Good catch. I'll make a correction.

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

It was a good interview until Dave went after the child again. It's got to stop. It's a poor reflection on his character to target a child in this way for approaching two years.

Surely he understands the difference between an explanation for how something possibly happened at a hastily convened hearing with 12 hours notice versus any explanation offered after months and months of a thorough investigation.

A child? I would not describe any 15-year-old as a child. Legally a minor and certainly not an adult, but also not a child.

I did not see that part of the interview yet, so I will reserve judgmental opinions until I see the rest of the interview.

In the meantime, can we be clear that the entire way the incident was handled to begin with by Russian authorities, by doping agencies, IOC and ISU, not to mention Russian coaches, has been a full-on mess. The full impact of the scandal has yet to be determined, much less definitively assessed. So, no excuses for anyone involved!

Kudos for Moskvina apparently adeptly dealing with Lease's unsurprising prying into matters that do not involve Moskvina, and that she clearly would never entangle herself in commenting on.

 

[lariko]

A child? I would not describe any 15-year-old as a child. Legally a minor and certainly not an adult, but also not a child.

Moreover, 17 yo.

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

Moreover, 17 yo.

Exactly, at the current time. But when the incident occurred, 15.

 

[Flying Feijoa]

I think Moskvina is all about specificity, training what actually gets performed in a competition. She was a little tight-lipped about what her skaters do to prep and also when Lease asked her about the number of run-throughs. She also underscored necessity of an individual approach to training/technique for each individual athlete, speaking against cookie-cut approaches to what to train on each day, how to jump--in other words, if the jump is landed, the jump is landed, so every skater does what they have to, to accomplish successful landing, be it jumping from the leg or helping with the upper body. Overall though, she wasn't at all enthusiastic about figures as an approach.

I admire Moskvina's professionalism, not even Dave can wring any tea out of her
Thank you for the summary!

I agree with her about there being specific benefits to figures. They are very good for teaching blade control/turn accuracy/maintaining flow (at a medium speed) but not a panacea for skating skills (Trixie Schuba comes to mind). To develop power/speed/deep kneebend, Patrick would also have practiced edges and footwork on big patterns across the rink just like people do now.
It's like how a ballet class always starts with barre exercises. They are important as foundational movements building onto other steps, but dancers don't normally spend 50% of the class time doing them (which was the case with compulsory figures in earlier years). They move into the centre and keep working as the basic steps get progressively more complex until eventually they get to the big jumps and turns.

 

[lariko]

Exactly, at the current time. But when the incident occurred, 15.

I am just pointing out the obvious that the 'attack on a child' pearl-clutching exercise has an expiry date.

 

[Arriba627]

Tamara has been on TSL at least twice, and she is a great interview! Very enjoyable. I know for sure she was also on in 2021.