Ross Miner suspended for 6 months by SafeSport for sexual harassment

[Amei]

It would be unlikely for Safesport to suspend someone without concrete evidence of malfeasance. I think we can assume that some inappropriate conduct occurred, was reported and was verified enough for Safesport to take action. It may or may not have been related to the subsequent tweets that were posted. Until those tweets are verified as having come from Ross, I still harbor doubt as to their veracity. But I have no doubt that Ross behaved inappropriately to someone in skating and that was reported and acted upon. What the sexual harassment was, we may never know. I agree that Ross's silence can be taken to imply acceptance of the ruling. Commenting on unverified evidence would not be wise in any circumstances.

I don't necessarily agree, in today's climate of the US you are presumed guilty until proven innocent in the public's eyes and I don't think SafeSport wants to have someone portray them as being soft on allegations. Food for thought on sexual harassment its a very broadly defined term to the point the UN says examples of sexual harassment include looking at someone, telling a crude joke, hugging someone, etc. We don't know the details of what led to Ross's suspension but given the very light punishment it really wouldn't shock me if it was something crazy stupid minor like an offensive dirty joke told to the wrong person. And as someone else pointed out his silence could be based on his lawyer's advice.

 

[Minz]

We don't know the details of what led to Ross's suspension but given the very light punishment it really wouldn't shock me if it was something crazy stupid minor like an offensive dirty joke told to the wrong person. And as someone else pointed out his silence could be based on his lawyer's advice.

I highly doubt that considering he got more of a punishment then Silvia Fontana, who helped cover up the Morgan Cipres situation. IIRC, Fontana got 6 months probation.

 

[Hooks1999]

It really saddens me to see so many people rushing to look for reasons to excuse his behavior when he has already been suspended by Safesport, who clearly found some evidence of wrongdoing. I wouldn't have believed I'd find people here saying things like "maybe the messages were from somebody else" or "maybe he was on drugs" or worst , "it was probably a minor joke", implying that the victim is just too sensitive and should have been ignored. Attitudes like these are why movements like Me Too came about, because too many people are quick to absolve the perpetrators of this kind of abuse and silence those who speak out, thus enabling the abuse to continue.

 

[el henry]

It really saddens me to see so many people rushing to look for reasons to excuse his behavior when he has already been suspended by Safesport, who clearly found some evidence of wrongdoing. I wouldn't have believed I'd find people here saying things like "maybe the messages were from somebody else" or "maybe he was on drugs" or worst , "it was probably a minor joke", implying that the victim is just too sensitive and should have been ignored. Attitudes like these are why movements like Me Too came about, because too many people are quick to absolve the perpetrators of this kind of abuse and silence those who speak out, thus enabling the abuse to continue.

I see no one rushing to excuse Ross, to imply the victims are too sensitive, or any of these other issues. Ross clearly did something for which SafeSport sanctioned him.

The fact that screenshots can be doctored is a fact. It is not excusing Ross. The fact that accounts can be hacked is a fact. It is not excusing Ross. Ross may very well have written those messages, in which case, he should (and will be) a pariah in skating forever.

We are on the Internet. No one here knows, unless they know posters personally, what people do in real life to assist victims of sexual abuse, to help survivors, or whether someone is even a survivor themselves. It is dangerous, in my opinion, to make assumptions

ETA: And I do not believe that in "today's climate" one is presumed guilty, nor do I believe that Ross received six months suspension simply for telling a joke. And I do not believe that jokes, in the wrong context, are "minor". Ross did something for which he received a suspension.

But we have no idea whether it was those vile screenshots unless more information comes out. And that is in no way undermining survivors.

 

[noskates]

I also don't think he was given "a very light punishment!" His reputation in the figure skating world is probably ruined forever. Sexual harassment, as was stated in this thread, can take many forms but being charged with it (and receiving any punishment) is damning and not soon forgotten. I would expect if coaching was his livelihood - that ship has sailed.

 

[icybear]

Surprising the people still defending him. Yes "defending" him. The court has ruled him guilty and you're still trying to mangle any ways to justify him. This isnt someone's word against another person. The court has obviously gone through all the allegations and evidence and has proven him guilty. Imagine how the victim must feel to see people saying their harassment is fake or just petty stuff. This is why victims dont come forward. Even when the court has proven them right, there are always some abuse apologists lurking around to deframe them.

 

[el henry]

Surprising the people still defending him. Yes "defending" him. The court has ruled him guilty and you're still trying to mangle any ways to justify him. This isnt someone's word against another person. The court has obviously gone through all the allegations and evidence and has proven him guilty. Imagine how the victim must feel to see people saying their harassment is fake or just petty stuff. This is why victims dont come forward. Even when the court has proven them right, there are always some abuse apologists lurking around to deframe them.

I have seen almost no one defending Ross. This statement is simply incorrect.

We don't know what the suspension was for. The "court" (whichever Safe Sport review panel determined the sanction) has not shared that information. We do not know if it was harassment. Whatever it was, it was serious enough to merit a suspension. That is troubling and should be taken very very seriously.

We do not know if Ross actually authored those sickening messages. If he did, six months seems very light.

Saying that we don't know if Ross authored those messages (not that he didn't, that we don't know, a very very different statement) does not mean that a poster is an "abuse apologist" or "defending" Ross. I don't understand the insistence on such a strained interpretation.

 

[ladyjane]

I have seen almost no one defending Ross. This statement is simply incorrect.

We don't know what the suspension was for. The "court" (whichever Safe Sport review panel determined the sanction) has not shared that information. We do not know if it was harassment. Whatever it was, it was serious enough to merit a suspension. That is troubling and should be taken very very seriously.

We do not know if Ross actually authored those sickening messages. If he did, six months seems very light.

Saying that we don't know if Ross authored those messages (not that he didn't, that we don't know, a very very different statement) does not mean that a poster is an "abuse apologist" or "defending" Ross. I don't understand the insistence on such a strained interpretation.

I'm with you. I've seen no one defending Ross, just questions about certain social media expressions which were harrowing (they really were, I was disgusted). But we don't know if they were for real. We only know that Safe sport suspended him, and that's reason enough for concluding that something bad has been going on. I don't see him not responding to USA Today as anything...not in favour, not against. But I do believe there will be a reason for the suspension. And I also believe it's the end of him in any Figure Skating role. Rightly so. I'm not defending him at all. I couldn't. It sickens me that these things continue to happen whatever they really are. What's wrong with these people?

 

[noskates]

Totally agree with ladyjane and el henry.

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

It really saddens me to see so many people rushing to look for reasons to excuse his behavior when he has already been suspended by Safesport, who clearly found some evidence of wrongdoing. I wouldn't have believed I'd find people here saying things like "maybe the messages were from somebody else" or "maybe he was on drugs" or worst , "it was probably a minor joke", implying that the victim is just too sensitive and should have been ignored. Attitudes like these are why movements like Me Too came about, because too many people are quick to absolve the perpetrators of this kind of abuse and silence those who speak out, thus enabling the abuse to contin

The whole situation is sad. Not the least being the usual rush to judgement in the form of completely erasing and castigating the accused perpetrator without any full knowledge of actual details. Much less any real knowledge of who Ross ever was or is, aside from snippets of memories of his skating performances and interviews.

What I know about the name Ross Miner, in recent years, is that it has become a punchline for all kinds of sly jokes on skating forums, perhaps partly to make light of the unfortunate personal sadness he experienced in being left off the 2018 Olympic team. Of course now, his name will forever be associated with something much worse. He seemed to deal with what happened in 2018 fairly well at the time, at least publicly. But maybe he didn't. And no, my mentioning this is not an excuse for terrible behavior toward others that he has been found to have engaged in.

FYI: fans on skating forums aren't different in their human reactions from other members of the general public. Thus, there is no way to predict how people will or should respond to news of this kind, especially when all the facts and details are not known by everyone commenting. Questions and accusations of all kinds are not out of the ordinary. Expecting everyone to conform to 'politically correct' public reactions is just another reaction. And most of the chatter around such news on social media simply amounts IMO to gossip, titillation and/ or grandstanding and bandwaggoning, with maybe a handful of people trying to be less judgmental and more thoughtful. Many people say nothing publicly which is likely the best reaction in the absence of full knowledge.

IMO, the purpose of the Me Too movement should be for awareness to be raised about all kinds of human abuses, so that all of us as humans can do what we can as individuals in our own lives to be better, and to support others in need. I don't think the movement should be used as a bludgeon or as an excuse to constantly join lynch mobs or to sit on high horses pointing fingers at reprehensible abusers. Human abuse will not end in our lifetimes. Sadly, terrible abuse is happening to someone at this moment and every moment, that in most instances will never come to light or be effectively resolved. Spending time and money to support groups helping victims of abuse is probably the most useful and productive response.

 

[Mathman]

I think the rteason that there is controversy is that we are not fully convinced about Safe Sport. Is it a "court?" What is the corresponding "court of appeals" for an unjust verdict? What are this court's criteria for admissible evidence? For that matter, what evidenc e was presented? Who is the procecutor, who speaks for the defense?

Someone is accused -- but of what exactly? -- then happens behind closed doors. A penalty is given out. Case closed.

The public will have one of two reactions. "I am suspicious of all so-called 'Authority' -- he was railroaded.

Or -- he is obviously guilty -- didn't the authorities just say so? -- throw the book at him.

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

Plus, it's important to realize that all humans are fallible, imperfect and capable of doing and saying terrible things. It is our conscience, upbringing and knowing right from wrong that usually guides people of goodwill. But even then, none of us are squeaky clean perfect in our thoughts and actions. Instead of thinking in extremes that people we don't know are saints, and then suddenly they are monsters when accused and convicted of abuse, why not accept that we never really know who people are.

Nor do we fully understand or can fathom all the causes and motivations involved in abusive behavior. Abuse is not 'one-size fits all.' Every situation is different. The worst abuses I've heard about and know about happen in families. It is scary and tragic. Also, nothing about abuse in figure skating is funny, not even when a name is spelled wrong, as someone claimed earlier.

Part of trying to address human abuse is not only awareness, but trying to uncover the causes. And not thinking about people in extremes.

 

[gsk8]

Ok folks. If members start calling out or harassing other members because they don't agree with others opinions, the thread will be closed and warnings will be issued. There is no reason you can't have a mature discussion without ranting, name-calling, etc.

 

[moonvine]

Well, exactly, These are the sort of tweets you see from a nasty 12 year old, not a grown up. I sort of wonder if someone else got ahold of his account. (My daughter got sent messages like this once, and when we got to the bottom of it, it was a younger brother who sent them)

Whatever the messages were, the tweet has been deleted.

 

[katymay]

I'm not convicting him nor defending him, because like the rest of you, I am not privy to ANY of the REAL facts. I said only this: That the snap chat (?) dialogue that appeared in screen shots on twitter does not seem to be adult authored. More like the correspondence of a bratty 12 year old.

 

[Minz]

I do wonder what actually went on in terms of sexual harassment. Regardless if he sent those messages or not, that would probably be categorized under “harassment of a minor” ”or “cyber bullying“. As far as I’m aware, (at least here in the US) those messages are enough to constitute their own charge. And on the Safe Sport database you can see some people have multiple charges against them, so you can have multiple charges.

This whole thing is getting more and more concerning to me...

 

[dorispulaski]

What I wish is that SafeSport would release a more complete description of what options are allowed to be listed in its database and what those options mean. It looks like different people fill out things differently, sad to say:

MSN

Since they suspended Ross Miner for 6 months, followed by probation, and a requirement that he take an education course on harassment, Safesport considers it less heinous than John Zimmerman covering up Cipres' sending dick pics to a student, and also intimidating the student and her family to keep it quiet (2 years' suspension).

And his offense was deemed less heinous than "criminal" charges, since those appear to be lifetime bans? Permanent Ineligiblility or Ineligible?

"Criminal" conduct varies from US state to US state. There is no evidence that a criminal complaint has been filed or a criminal investigation started so far. In Massachusetts,

What is Criminal Harassment in Massachusetts?

Criminal harassment can be a serious offense in Massachusetts and can carry jail time. The law is designed to protect people who are being stalked.

mwpetersonlaw.com

harassment can involve jail time, can be electronic, but requires 3 or more events. . Sexual harassment involves more jail time, but appears to be an employment linked charge:

Massachusetts law about sexual harassment

Laws, regulations, cases, and web & print sources on sexual harassment, including in the workplace, in housing, and in educational settings.

www.mass.gov

Age of consent in Massachusetts is 16. SafeSport mentions when minors are involved, and that is not mentioned in Ross Miner' s SafeSport record.

Here is SafeSport' s Disciplinary database for figure skating:

Centralized Disciplinary Database | U.S. Center for SafeSport

This public database lists adults in the U.S. Olympic & Paralympic Movement whose sport participation is restricted based on SafeSport Code violation.

uscenterforsafesport.org

If the conduct is "criminal," the action taken is "Ineligible."

If a minor is involved, that seems to be noted in the description of the offense.

 

[alexocfp]

Think we are missing an important detail here. Safesport is an organization, not a criminal investigatory entity.

You don‘t have to commit a crime to be suspended under safesport auspices.

They are keeping the details quiet because they may not want to compromise other aspects of the case.

That being said, everyone has a right to appeal, so they will need to show their hand sooner or later. But if he is guilty, throw the book at him.

That being said, don’t know enough to comment on this particular case, but getting predators out of sports should be everyone’s goal.

Let‘s see how this plays out.

 

[el henry]

This is a guide from SafeSport regarding the investigatory process. I haven't done enough of a deep dive to know if this is the most recent one.

https://uscenterforsafesport.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/Investigations-FAQ-Aug-2019.pdf

There are violations of Safe Sport guidelines (harassment, bullying, actions involving people who are not minors) that may not be criminal. As @dorispulaski has pointed out, when parallel criminal cases are ongoing or have concluded, historically the sanctions have been more severe.

US Figure Skating, I believe, requires all members to abide by the Safe Sport code of conduct. I believe a rink or a club would require an employee or contractor to do so as matter of contract for using their facilities, but I cannot say I have read any rink' or club's contracts on the matter.

As a result, SafeSport need only comply with its own guidelines in an investigation. It does not need to proffer any of protections that would apply to the government seeking to imprison someone (although they appear to have them). This is essentially a violation of a contract.

One very important reason for confidentiality in these cases is to protect complainants. It should be entirely up to the Complainant whether they speak out, and they may choose never to do so. Or they may choose to. Entirely up to them.

 

[jenaj]

What is the point of issuing a suspension but not saying what it's for? If they want it to have a deterrent effect, they need to tell people what he did. We also don't know if the suspension was fair given the offense. It seems like Safesport is trying to insulate it from criticism.