I'm still struggling to get on the Marin Honda train. She's lovely, and she seems to have the heart of a performer, but she still hasn't gained the consistency of a Satoko Miyahara for me to consider her the one to beat. However, these next five years could be a interesting time for her!
Should JSF push Marin Honda as No.1?
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I am struggling with the Marin Honda buzz too. She has great extension and posture and she seems to have some choreography in her programs. That's more than can be said for Higuchi, Mihara, and Hongo. But I find Marin's skating to be kind of flat. Everything looks nice and polished, but I don't get authenticity of emotion or real charisma from her programs.
She's young and she definitely has promise. But for now, I think Miyahara is a much better performer and the deserving Japanese #1.
She's young and she definitely has promise. But for now, I think Miyahara is a much better performer and the deserving Japanese #1.
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I doubt very hard she's going to get either. Quads would IMO require an outstanding jumper, in both raw power and technique, and Marin is neither. And her 2A doesn't look good enough either to me... I mean, it's not as if we had any senior lady out there landing this stuff right now (both Mao & Liza are currently having a hard time), so maybe it will never be important when it comes to the fight for the big medals. However, I really hope we'll get one or two ladies with beautiful 3A's to push the sport again. There are better jumpers in Japan trying this jump too - including Rika Kihira actually landing it. (Unrelated: I hope Rika heals well and comes back stronger than before - this girl has a lot of potential!).
It's not a mattress but close enough to crack me up. See the true reigning japanese princess.
The rest of that post doesn't deserve a serious answer either.
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Where does Wakaba look like a peasant? If were only going by looks I think Wakaba has nothing to fear. She is beautiful and looks like a lady and mature for her age. She's just not as expressive as others, but that can come with time. And better programs. Sorry, but her programs are a bore. If she wants to medal she has to have better programs next season.
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Marin is going through growth spurt right now, she has grown a lot in the last months. What do you expect from such a young girl? I have the feeling some people deliberately compare her to older girls just to push her down and to say "look, she is s***", because they don't have other arguments to bash a junior girl :disapp:
It must be great to hate 14/15 year old children :sarcasm:
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:luv17:
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So? What's wrong with me finding other Japanese girls more promising than Marin? Rika Kihara can do 8 triples LP, and she even landed 3A3T in practice. Mai is not weaker than Marin when it comes to spins and skating skills (the girl is scarily fast) and her jumps even though do not seem to be super powerful, still look better than Marin. Wakaba with bigger jumps has huge presence and speed on ice when she's on. Yuna Shiraiwa also has great potential. None of these girls is weaker than Marin at all.
I remember all the talks from Marin's PR team about her training 3A and 4S and she even said she will land 4S in Olympic 2018. If she can do, amazing. I am looking fowards to it. But until now I haven't seen any attempt of those jumps from her WITHOUT harness.
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Well, don't you just expect her to break into a Les Miserable working class song and throw a sack of coal around everytime you see her?
No? Well, me neither. And yes, all those pictures were necessary
As for the expressiveness/elegance - she's not Mao or Satoko and naturally as graceful & delicate, but she has her own strengths and is just a generally different type of skater. However, just compare her this season to the ones before, and you can see the work and attention they put into making her more elegant and refined, and it's paying off already. She could do with better programs though, that is true.
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I actually think Wakaba is expressive in her individual way. Scheherazade is a bit generic but her La Califfa SP is amazing. The maturity and improved skating skills shine in that program. It gives me chills every time I watch it. I always try to see beyond a skater's shortcomings so I've always preferred Wakaba over Marin since they were both juniors, even though Marin had the superior programs/choreography. I can see and connect with Wakaba's personality which is written all over her skating. Marin is something like Marilyn Monroe, she attracts attention because she feeds on attention. She knows how to work with the camera and the audience because she's been doing that since she was born. I guess that's what leaves me cold. I can appreciate her great skating skills and musicality but the fact that she's "camera pro" doesn't make her a better skater than Satoko, Mai, Wakaba, Yuna.
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Well, don't you just expect her to break into a Les Miserable working class song and throw a sack of coal around everytime you see her?
No? Well, me neither. And yes, all those pictures were necessary
As for the expressiveness/elegance - she's not Mao or Satoko and naturally as graceful & delicate, but she has her own strengths and is just a generally different type of skater. However, just compare her this season to the ones before, and you can see the work and attention they put into making her more elegant and refined, and it's paying off already. She could do with better programs though, that is true.
Haha, not for me, I always thought she is one of the prettiest skaters coming from Japan. You even changed your Yuzu avatar to Wakaba, if that's not telling...*grin*
I think the discussion in this thread just proves that JSF doesn't have to worry much. There was a bit of a draught in the last years but those Ladies who are coming up in the ranks have quality. And quantity. If Marin doesn't bring it, there are plenty of Ladies who will. Not only Russia has a bright future.
People are so sensitive now aday. Miss Mao was peddling the stupid mattress, airweave, in Ginza and that's why I brought up the princess and the pea. No one will believe Wakaba with the mattress but they will with Mao and Marin. That's just fact. I happen to go to Japan all the time so I see it. Satoko can win 20 championships and she's still nobody. Same with wakaba, mai, all other girls who aren't lucky in the look department. You have to have a certain kind of look.
Miki is a different story, she can sell crap herself even though she wasn't considered a traditional Japanese beauty. She's more exotic, a counter example to Mao.
You want a girl who has potential and look so you can market and sell. Ads don't come to figure skating unless they have a good reason to. So yes, they want Marin as #1.
Miki is a different story, she can sell crap herself even though she wasn't considered a traditional Japanese beauty. She's more exotic, a counter example to Mao.
You want a girl who has potential and look so you can market and sell. Ads don't come to figure skating unless they have a good reason to. So yes, they want Marin as #1.
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While I understand your argument I just don't simply see Wakaba as being 'unlucky' in the looks department. Do you really think she is not as attractive as Mao or Miki? Marin has a different look, more cute/kawaii which is always popular in Japan. But I don't see Wakaba far off, she has a more womanly charm, imho. Maybe that's the westerner in me speaking, but I don't think Marin overshadows them all with her otherwordly beauty. But beauty is in the eye of the beholder so the discussion is not going anywhere, I guess.
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Well, I'd rather her be nobody in Ginza and somebody in figure skating. She already is. She's the one they call "miss perfect" in the media.
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Wakaba is quite pretty by Asian standard actually.
And some people seem to forget, Mao won many competitions at SENIOR events since very young that's why she's selling stuffs.
For Marin to archive the status like Mao among PR and marketer, she needs to win GPF at the age 15, silver at WC at the age of 16, WC at the age of 17, 18... It is not a dismiss of Mao, BUT if you think Mao can sell all those stuffs without all her medals and titles, it's naive. She sells stuffs because she has star quality AND she has won major competitions. Even Sharapova has won five Grand Slam and many other medals. There is no way star quality alone can help atheles sell stuff.
it is not that easy for Marin to archive the same titles as Mao did at young age, especially today when all ladies are landing 7 triples left and right consistently. The ladies have become much more consistent and competitive than 2005 era. If they want to make Marin a super star like Mao, she should win GPF next season when she turns senior before all. With an army of Russian ladies, is that easy? Not to mention Satoko will definitely be Japanese no.1 at least next season. It is not a piece of cake for Marin.
Marin is a nice skater with great skating skills for her age. She has great quality and flow. But if we DO NOT take her star quality into account, she is NOT better than many top girls at her age. Many girls can jump better than her. Many girls can spin better than her. And they can be more consistent than her too. Several Japanese girls at her age can do better than her in competitions. Of course she will get higher GOE and PCS than many girls, but it does not mean she can handle the pressure of being Japanese no.1
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I was about to say this because all of this talk about Wakaba was getting me massively confused. Wakaba is very beautiful per Asian standards which frankly is all that counts anyway in terms of any potential sponsorship or ad deals, in terms of beauty. Plus I think she's beautiful in general, I am really not sure how this is 'unlucky' in the looks department. I hereby volunteer to be this unlucky. From a purely personal point of view, I find her to be more beautiful than Marin.
What will make her more attractive? What Meoima said goes for her too. If she starts being successful on the international scene, that's the main draw.
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Of course Marin has to show more results before she can get the kind of status Mao is getting. This is why they should push her now. She is and should be the face of Japan skating. She has potential and face and skating skills. Push her.
I didn't say those girls got beat with an ugly stick. They just don't look a certain way that is marketable. You wouldn't understand unless you look at all the ads in Japan. It's a certain look they are after. If you think otherwise, nothing else to say.
I didn't say those girls got beat with an ugly stick. They just don't look a certain way that is marketable. You wouldn't understand unless you look at all the ads in Japan. It's a certain look they are after. If you think otherwise, nothing else to say.
Well, I'd rather her be nobody in Ginza and somebody in figure skating. She already is. She's the one they call "miss perfect" in the media.
I think she rather be somebody in Ginza as well as somebody in skating. Why you have to pick only one?
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So what if they're after Marin? They can not turn her into a second Mao if she mess competitions and could not archive the major titles Mao got at the same age. Being pretty with star quality alone does not help. She needs to win first, which is much more difficult than 2005 era as the ladies are more competitive and consistent now. Simple as that.
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