2019-20 U.S. Ladies Figure Skating

[drivingmissdaisy]

Anyway, I'll echo some of the concern here around her coaching situation. Ultimately, if she's happy with her coaching situation and they are giving her the emotional support she needs, great. But I seriously question the wisdom of Vincent posting videos of the 3A and quad attempts when she is still in the process of being able to run-through her entire programs with all of the elements included successfully. Like, if the harness attempts are helpful to Gracie and they're a bit of fun for her, that's great! But posting them online to build fan hype? He's setting up expectations for Gracie that she's not currently able to meet, and that seems like a bad idea.

Gracie has so many areas she needs to improve to get back to her peak form: speed, more intricate choreography, more consistent jumps and other technical elements. Beyond that, to get back to where she was as a gold medal threat at international competitions, she also needs the jumps she's practicing in the harness. I see the videos as nothing more than to show how hard she's working to get there. There aren't enough hours in the day to improve every aspect of her skating to get it to where it was before, but prioritizing the jumps at this point in her comeback is probably a good choice. It was interesting that she landed two lutzes, a flip, and a loop, but not any 2A or 3S jumps when she's training the 3A and 4S. Maybe the harness training is affecting the timing of the easier elements.

 

[brightphoton]

... can still have a fight for one of the 3 spots.

Well, about that ... I have some bad news for you from 2018 World's

 

[KatGrace1925]

Well, about that ... I have some bad news for you from 2018 World's

I think it’s more about a hope that we have 3 spots for the olympics not about 3 spots for this year. If Gracie is to be a contender again it’s unlikely to happen this season.

 

[KatGrace1925]

What frustrates me about the conversation concerning Gracie is people have always been nasty about her skating. From the moment she won nationals everyone was criticizing her and picking apart why she’ll never be good enough to win. Everytime she won people acted like she didn’t deserve it and everytime she lost people picked her apart as unable to go all the way.

She has said she used to look up her name on twitter and online and that is horrific given how nasty people always were when it was about her. She had supporters but very loud, very rude detractors and it seems people are still all running to give their negative 2 cents on why she can’t.

We’ve been around this block before and no one has learned anything. I really hope she doesn’t go online like she did in the past cause the comments haven’t gotten better after what she’s been through.

And with how nasty people are towards Alysa I am starting to feel that skating fans are one of the most toxic groups online. These are young girls working very hard to succeed at an extremely difficult sport, stop being so negative towards them.

 

[chuckm]

The toxic figure skating fans have their own favorites and feel a need to attack anyone who is a rival of that favorite. Stupid? Absolutely.

 

[Mishaminion]

It's relatively mild here.
Comments on YouTube skating videos are often downright disgusting and evil.

 

[b-man]

Read on the other forum from Sylvia that Ting has withdrawn from Finlandia.

 

[randomfan]

What frustrates me about the conversation concerning Gracie is people have always been nasty about her skating. From the moment she won nationals everyone was criticizing her and picking apart why she’ll never be good enough to win. Everytime she won people acted like she didn’t deserve it and everytime she lost people picked her apart as unable to go all the way.

She has said she used to look up her name on twitter and online and that is horrific given how nasty people always were when it was about her. She had supporters but very loud, very rude detractors and it seems people are still all running to give their negative 2 cents on why she can’t.

We’ve been around this block before and no one has learned anything. I really hope she doesn’t go online like she did in the past cause the comments haven’t gotten better after what she’s been through.

And with how nasty people are towards Alysa I am starting to feel that skating fans are one of the most toxic groups online. These are young girls working very hard to succeed at an extremely difficult sport, stop being so negative towards them.

I completely agree with this. I’ve seen many brutal comments for most skaters in general, but some of the worst ones were towards Gracie and other U.S. skaters. People need to start thinking about how powerful their words can be, online or in-person.

Speaking about harsh comments towards U.S. skaters, not only is Alysa receiving way too much nowadays, but also Bradie. I don’t understand why so many people seem to have such a big problem with Bradie. For starters, even GS has some brutal commenters...

 

[macy]

Read on the other forum from Sylvia that Ting has withdrawn from Finlandia.

was just going to post this, i hope shes not injured

 

[andromache]

Gracie has so many areas she needs to improve to get back to her peak form: speed, more intricate choreography, more consistent jumps and other technical elements. Beyond that, to get back to where she was as a gold medal threat at international competitions, she also needs the jumps she's practicing in the harness. I see the videos as nothing more than to show how hard she's working to get there. There aren't enough hours in the day to improve every aspect of her skating to get it to where it was before, but prioritizing the jumps at this point in her comeback is probably a good choice. It was interesting that she landed two lutzes, a flip, and a loop, but not any 2A or 3S jumps when she's training the 3A and 4S. Maybe the harness training is affecting the timing of the easier elements.

I just don't think it's practical to share videos of the jumps in harness and build unrealistic expectations. If they want to show how hard she is working, show us the combos she is working on (which they have done), her spins, footwork sequences, etc. I don't care if they're spending a bit of every day on practicing 3As and quads, but as a social media strategy it almost feels exploitative.

 

[KatGrace1925]

I just don't think it's practical to share videos of the jumps in harness and build unrealistic expectations. If they want to show how hard she is working, show us the combos she is working on (which they have done), her spins, footwork sequences, etc. I don't care if they're spending a bit of every day on practicing 3As and quads, but as a social media strategy it almost feels exploitative.

It does feel exploitative. I do not think Gracie is choosing to show these things but the coaches are doing it.

 

[skylark]

What frustrates me about the conversation concerning Gracie is people have always been nasty about her skating. From the moment she won nationals everyone was criticizing her and picking apart why she’ll never be good enough to win.

I don't think it was ever "everyone." But I understand that it can feel that way, when you love her and her skating.

Everytime she won people acted like she didn’t deserve it and everytime she lost people picked her apart as unable to go all the way.

That's exactly what happened with Ashley Wagner, at least since 2015, when I began frequenting this forum. And to tell the truth, not nearly as many people leapt to Ashley's defense as leap to Gracie's. But when one is emotionally invested, the picking apart and mean comments are painful. And the supportive voices are generally quieter. It's not right, but there it is.

We’ve been around this block before and no one has learned anything.

I wouldn't say "no one."

Quote Originally Posted by moonvine
But I don't understand why she is such a polarizing figure. There are skaters I don't care for, but you won't see me up in their threads criticising them

Well, this isn't Gracie's thread, and if I understand the purpose of a US ladies' thread, it's to allow discussion of negatives and positives. Not that I always like the comments. I don't. And I wish people wouldn't make personally insulting comments. But a certain amount of freedom is allowed. One way to think about it is that I have to ask myself why I don't just stay away from all but the fan forums? And it's because all praise doesn't quite give me a broader perspective. So, we all have to find a way to deal with negative remarks. I don't do it perfectly, because I'm an emotional person who's emotionally invested. But I'm trying.

If we want mods to do something about a remark, we have to report it. 'and not engage with it.

 

[oly2018]

I think there needs to be a happy medium in regards to discussing Gracie. How much someone weighs is kind of irrelevant to this discussion and also just against the rules. However, I don't think it is realistic for anyone if Gracie is discussed with kid gloves. She is an adult in a competitive sport who has said she is aiming for the upper echelon (Beijing). Discussions about her coaching team and the decisions they are collectively making should be fair game.

I think it is awesome that she has gained back enough confidence to put herself out there competitively again. But, I think the coaching situation doesn't match her stated goal. I am curious to see what her next steps will be after this competitive season because imo, they may need to bring in some consultants for skating skills and spins. Vincent clearly can teach her the jump tech, but spin levels and step sequences are important too.

 

[el henry]

I would wager that the videos on Instagram are Coach Vincent’s idea.

This is what he does. When he was at 7K, it seemed he was constantly posting practice videos. As a Jason fan, I appreciated it, but I certainly wasn’t coming to any conclusions based on practice videos, and I think the vast majority of Gracie fans here did not come to conclusions either.

Gracie evidently has a trust level with Vincent, and that’s important, and if that’s who she wants to coach her, fine. This is what Vincent does, he did it with Jason, he’s doing it with her, and I’m assuming she just accepts it as part of training with Vincent. I don’t think Vincent is exploiting Gracie, he’s just doing what he’s always done.

And if Gracie wants him to do differently, she and Vincent need to have a convo. :think:

 

[Bluediamonds09]

On a different topic, are there any competitions happening this week or this weekend that will feature any US ladies?

 

[drivingmissdaisy]

I just don't think it's practical to share videos of the jumps in harness and build unrealistic expectations. If they want to show how hard she is working, show us the combos she is working on (which they have done), her spins, footwork sequences, etc. I don't care if they're spending a bit of every day on practicing 3As and quads, but as a social media strategy it almost feels exploitative.

I get what you're saying, and I largely agree. But people really are interested in how she's progressing, and I probably see less harm than most in her and the team posting those videos. None of us thought she was going to come out with a 3A or 4S last weekend, and I wasn't expecting her to do the 3-3 when she only started landing it in practice not too long ago.

I do think Gracie is currently skating better than what she showed last weekend in competition. I was expecting worse after seeing the TSL video of her practice missing lutz after lutz. However, she landed 2 of 3, went 1 for 2 on the flip, and landed the only loop she tried, so she's almost got the hard stuff in good shape. The axels are obviously a problem, but the salchow pop might have just been due to stamina issues. Overall, it's pretty positive step for a skater who hasn't done a good long program in over 3 1/2 years.

 

[frida80]

On a different topic, are there any competitions happening this week or this weekend that will feature any US ladies?

Finlandia is this weekend with Megan and Starr. Ting had drop out for reasons unknown.

 

[tosca]

Finlandia is this weekend with Megan and Starr. Ting had drop out for reasons unknown.

Ugh TING!

 

[Silver Ice]

Just watched Bradie's long program from Japan Open, and woah she looks great. Very elegant out there. She looks like she actually feels this music rather than just skating to it and making movements. Artistry may not come natural to her, but this music and program suit her very well.

 

[KatGrace1925]

I completely agree with this. I’ve seen many brutal comments for most skaters in general, but some of the worst ones were towards Gracie and other U.S. skaters. People need to start thinking about how powerful their words can be, online or in-person.

Speaking about harsh comments towards U.S. skaters, not only is Alysa receiving way too much nowadays, but also Bradie. I don’t understand why so many people seem to have such a big problem with Bradie. For starters, even GS has some brutal commenters...

I agree about Bradie as well. When the USFS started backing her people started acting really negative towards her. I feel like figure skating fans are either super objective or super negative. Someone mentioned Ashley Wagner I agree she was the same, I always loved Ashley and there was constant negative on her. It’s especially terrible among figure skating fans on twitter but I’ve seen it here too. There used to be many threads on Gracie and Ashley on here that were negative and not productive. I am glad people don’t seem to make threads like that anymore.

I will also say there’s a lot of negativity towards other girls as well not just the US girls, but we’re discussing the US girls here.