2019-20 U.S. Ladies Figure Skating

[Oshun]

Sorry, Bradie does better all the time but still is such a snooze to watch. There are some things about a skater that cannot be changed. There has to be more warmth, charisma, joy, exceedingly expectations, or a sense of something more than simply an obvious reflection of a good work ethic. Champions in any sport have to give their fans some sense of excitement and surprise in their performance to be considered great and figure skating with its music choices, costumes, and theatricality presumes one can deliver even more of that kind of magic than most sports. I don't get any of that kind of enchantment with Bradie. I got it with Mariah and also with Alysa--although in the latter cases with really different strengths and weaknesses.

I thought the Nationals Ladies' podium was exactly what it should have been. But the one I wanted to see more of was Mariah. Alysa has years to grow into her talent. I'd love to see her around for a long time.

 

[lpt]

I can’t get into them. Then again I can’t get into the Russian ladies performances. It just isn’t my cup of tea.

Just wait and see what do we think about US ladies performances in Russian ladies' thread

 

[jenaj]

I read several commentors talking down Mariah’s skating skills. And it’s not offensive to say Alysa skates like a 14 year old, because she does. Her skating is kind of boring because it’s very juniorish. She has bright points that show how she could grow but I don’t expect mature programs from her at 13/14.

It's not a zero sum game. You can like Mariah without disliking Alysa. And vice versa.

 

[oatmella]

Some of the arguments in this thread lol

‘Mariah’s performance gave me chills/made me cry/it was the skating moment of the decade, she should have won”
There aren’t bonus points for “special moments”

“14 year olds shouldn’t be allowed to compete at senior Nationals”
No valid reason given, other than Alysa prevented your favorite from winning.

“Bradie and Alysa are boring!”
This is subjective.

“PCS should be worth more”
Alysa and Bradie have been working hard to increase their technical difficulty, Alysa with 3A and quads and Bradie has trained -3Lo combo and 3A. They have also worked to improve in PCS aspects, and many have acknowledged this.

 

[Greengemmonster]

Speaking of Bradie, her improvement has been astounding to me.

Bradie went from tepid Cinderella (I say this with love I was just not a fan back then) to badass hunger games heroine to sassy fun thing and then angsty/bittersweet love affair.

Her GPF performance gave me chills.

If someone had pointed to Olympics Bradie and said to me "You will love this girl and you will be cheering for her to podium at every tournament" I would have laughed in their face back then.

 

[crazydreamer]

I think at the moment there is simply too much importance placed on soulless, technical aspects of skating. It’s not just the BV of jumps, but also the GOE on jumps and the PCS for transitions and skating skills. The scoring system encourages skaters to do very technically complex programs, and awards only skimpy points for performing or interpretation or having choreography that makes stylistic sense and is beautiful.

For me, and many others, it is the performance aspect of skating that makes it unique among sports. I certainly appreciate quads and triple axels when they are appropriately used in a program, but watching a series of quads without music would get old pretty fast.

That said, performance is highly subjective. The reason the system is the way it is now is because a decade or two ago, the viewership decided the scoring was too subjective. So they tried to emphasize objective features like elements and transitions.

I think they went too far, but it’s hard to see what the appropriate balance is.

 

[Bluediamonds09]

Question: who designs Alysa’s costumes? And Bradie’s?

Also, this has nothing to do with Alysa, but who was the girl in the senior nationals sp wearing Samantha Cesario’s Tania Bass-designed dress?

 

[Greengemmonster]

Performance is very subjective. I've watched Alysa's performance 8 times now and I smile like a moron whenever I watch it.

I get angsty (in a good way) when I watch Bradie's FP.

It irks me what just because someone doesn't like a program they go around declaring that it's boring and empty like it's universal truth. It's not.

There are plenty of programs I don't like. I just don't talk about them and just because I don't like them it doesn't mean they are rubbish or there is anything wrong with them.

 

[drivingmissdaisy]

I think at the moment there is simply too much importance placed on soulless, technical aspects of skating. It’s not just the BV of jumps, but also the GOE on jumps and the PCS for transitions and skating skills. The scoring system encourages skaters to do very technically complex programs, and awards only skimpy points for performing or interpretation or having choreography that makes stylistic sense and is beautiful.

For me, and many others, it is the performance aspect of skating that makes it unique among sports. I certainly appreciate quads and triple axels when they are appropriately used in a program, but watching a series of quads without music would get old pretty fast.

Does it diminish your enjoyment of an event if a program you liked didn't win? Once I accepted that my favorite performances aren't necessarily the ones that deserved to win, I started to enjoy the sport a lot more. Certainly Mariah would have been a deserving champion, and her long program is one that I'll go back and watch again. However, those 3A's are extremely difficult and still pretty rare, and should garner the points they earned.

 

[SorrySkater]

I think think it depends on your definition of best skater. As someone else pointed out earlier, Alysa is a great jumper. It’s not all about jumps, though. In terms of all-around skating, Mariah is better. My personal preference is for Mariah’s style. I think Alysa will get there eventually.

 

[Mathman]

I thik (Alyssa) will do well. Unlike the Russians...

Would that be the Russian seniors who just went 1-2-3 at Europeans after going 1-2-3 at the Grand Prix final and who are expected to go 1-2-3 at Wolrds?

Anyway, Go Alyssa!

 

[chuckm]

Mariah Bell seems like a genuinely nice person, but I have to say I loathe her musical selections this season. Britney Spears? Yuck! and Double yuck to Hallelujah, that overdone chestnut with the idiotic rhymes. I just could not get into her skating because of the dreadful music.

 

[Greengemmonster]

I was a teen of the very late 90s so I loved the Britney Spears SP and the ponytail.

I was kinda hoping she'd go all out and do "Oops" but that was probably a bridge too far so some Britney is better than no Britney at all.

 

[crazydreamer]

Does it diminish your enjoyment of an event if a program you liked didn't win? Once I accepted that my favorite performances aren't necessarily the ones that deserved to win, I started to enjoy the sport a lot more. Certainly Mariah would have been a deserving champion, and her long program is one that I'll go back and watch again. However, those 3A's are extremely difficult and still pretty rare, and should garner the points they earned.

No it doesn’t necessarily diminish my appreciation my enjoyment, but I worry that if skaters like Mariah or Satoko or Evgenia etc. don’t have a chance of winning, they will move on to other careers and we will be left with only the types of performances that don’t move me.

You see it in Alina’s decision to retire. Alina used to be a jumping bean without much artistry. In the past year she has really shown serious development as an artist, but since she sees no path to remaining on the Russian team she is leaving the sport.

While winning isn’t everything to me, it means a lot for the skaters’ motivations.

 

[Figure 8's]

I read several commentors talking down Mariah’s skating skills. And it’s not offensive to say Alysa skates like a 14 year old, because she does. Her skating is kind of boring because it’s very juniorish. She has bright points that show how she could grow but I don’t expect mature programs from her at 13/14.

All in what you want to see. You obviously dislike her so you are being very judgemental towards Alysa. I don't see much juniorsish in Alysa's skating. She outshines everyone with her Technical Ability. She skates with joy and enthusiasm. These are emotions too. Facts are if the others want to be competitive with her they are going to have to step it up. Just like the Russians. Alyona has not done quads but she can do gorgeous Tripple Axels. I feel sorry for you that you are so bitter that you are blind to how well Alysa skates.

 

[arewhyaen]

Speaking of Bradie, her improvement has been astounding to me.

Bradie went from tepid Cinderella (I say this with love I was just not a fan back then) to badass hunger games heroine to sassy fun thing and then angsty/bittersweet love affair.

Her GPF performance gave me chills.

If someone had pointed to Olympics Bradie and said to me "You will love this girl and you will be cheering for her to podium at every tournament" I would have laughed in their face back then.

That's interesting, because I feel like this is the source of my problem for Bradie. I have no idea who she is because every season is a new narrative for her. Fortunately, it seems like she's finally found a sense of self, and I hope that can translate to her future programs.

 

[crazydreamer]

All in what you want to see. You obviously dislike her so you are being very judgemental towards Alysa. I don't see much juniorsish in Alysa's skating. She outshines everyone with her Technical Ability. She skates with joy and enthusiasm. These are emotions too. Facts are if the others want to be competitive with her they are going to have to step it up. Just like the Russians. Alyona has not done quads but she can do gorgeous Tripple Axels. I feel sorry for you that you are so bitter that you are blind to how well Alysa skates.

I disagree. Take Don’t Rain on My Parade for example. That is a sassy, witty, funny, defiant song. I don’t really see any of that reflected in Alysa’s performance. Rather, what I see is a young girl who loves skating. The emotion/thought that Alysa (and Sasha and Anna for that matter) give me is “oh she’s so cute.” And it’s the same for everything else I’ve seen her slate to. That is why I think many people consider her “juniorish” — she does not have the maturity to embody the themes/characters she is presenting.

Compare that to Mariah and Bradie, who both have elements of sassiness, sultriness, joy and pain and many other emotions in their performances.

It’s not about hating Alysa or being bitter. I think Alysa has every ability to develop her performance abilities in time, I just don’t think she’s there yet. And I think the system should encourage her to develop her artistic ability, not just hope that because she’s an obviously driven person she will go the extra (apparently unnecessary) mile.

 

[readernick]

All in what you want to see. You obviously dislike her so you are being very judgemental towards Alysa. I don't see much juniorsish in Alysa's skating. She outshines everyone with her Technical Ability. She skates with joy and enthusiasm. These are emotions too. Facts are if the others want to be competitive with her they are going to have to step it up. Just like the Russians. Alyona has not done quads but she can do gorgeous Tripple Axels. I feel sorry for you that you are so bitter that you are blind to how well Alysa skates.

People are allowed to have different opinions. It doesn't mean they are bitter and it doesn't mean they have personal dislike for a skater. Alyssa is adorable and has improved a lot since last year. Her jumps have improved and so have her SS. I don't find her to be a compelling performer but that doesn't make me bitter. Few 14 year olds are compelling performers and they should not be expected to be...I watched the Junior Grand Prix and even the "artistic" 13/14 year olds aren't emotive nor do they draw me into their skating. However, I find a number of them impressive and adorable. Alyssa is among that number.

If skating was a performance art, Mariah would have won this competition. It isn't. It's a sport ....so Alyssa won. People are not required to love the winning program though... there are great performances and there are winning ones.. they often aren't the same.

 

[Greengemmonster]

Nothing wrong with disagreeing with the results. Nothing wrong with not liking the winner or winning program and saying so.

Constantly picking apart the winner's program and abilities, constantly whinging about the judging, calling for a change in the rules.......that makes for a bitter person.

 

[brightphoton]

We can't ever have changes in rules, that never ever happens in figure skating. Nope, we have had this one judging system for all time, and all the point values and grade of execution have been set since the first amateur lady and man decided to make this sport

It's amazing how short people's memories are.