Jeremy Abbott ‘kind of on the fence’ about retiring

[Duality]

Incorrect.

He was asked directly by a journalist which event he would choose. He answered the team event and let Kovtun do the individual because HE THOUGHT THAT WAS AN OPTION. When he was informed of the actual rules, he was very definite that he would do both.

And so he did, until that awful moment when the screw snapped in his back.

Plushenko is not the villain here no matter how much you try to make him into one: he told the Russian Fed to call Kovtun the day after the team event, when there was still the possibility of withdrawing. The Russian Fed lied to his face and told them they couldn't find Kovtun. Kovtun meanwhile was awaiting a call that would never come. Plushy then said that he could do it, and maybe he thought that with enough painkillers he could.

As to Plushenko's PCS: well, perhaps he ought to earn some points for actually trying, which was something Abbott could not say about the team event.

He was very definite to do both only in his interviews. But actions speak louder than words. There wasn' t possibility of withdrawing cause he didn't have new injury only old ones. And Plushenko isn't the main villain because the main villain is Russian federation of figure skating. The federation could stop Plushenko and Yana' s craziness and to send Kovtun or Voronov to OG instead but it didn't. Plushenko didn't win Russian Nationals even with his crazy components, didn't participate in any competitions this season, except Russian Nationals and Volvo Cup, had many injuries but he still decided that he was the one who deserved to go to OG though there were other Russian figure skaters better than him.

Plushenko is a liar so don't believe him that he wanted to participate but got such an unexpected injury just a moment before the competition. Remember an interview where he said that the federation made him to participate?)) What a lie. After it he of course took his words back claiming he didn't understand English))

 

[BlackPack]

The Plush-Kotvun-Russian Fed saga has quite a few threads already. As spectators there's no way we would know what happened behind the scenes, only what the people involved tell the press. I think the only things we can safely assess is that Kovtun was shortchanged and that Plush shouldn't have pushed his body to the point of abuse.

Back to Abbott, I think he would do very well as a choreographer and music consultant for skaters. Starting another career that would utilize his artistic abilities at the level that would satisfy him would be hard.

 

[kefelsted]

It's not as if he's the only one though - in fairness to Jeremy, many of the figure skaters who 'won' medals at the Olympics in the Team Event are putting it on their résumés, Twitter profiles, etc.

Has there been any discussion of eliminating the Team Event from the next Olympics? That would put a stop to this medal controversy for next time.

I actually liked the Team Event and want to see it continue. I don't have a problem with people talking about/listing their team medals although I think they should be labeled as such. When I said I'd be embarrassed to include it on my resume if I was Jeremy, I meant because he got a medal with such a poor performance. I don't remember any of the other team medalists having such a poor performance. My comment wasn't really about the "legalities" of talking about your team medal but about Jeremy's performance. I think it would be hard to live with having gotten a medal with such a performance. Any skater in that position would have to wish it were different.

 

[LRK]

The Plush-Kotvun-Russian Fed saga has quite a few threads already. As spectators there's no way we would know what happened behind the scenes, only what the people involved tell the press. I think the only things we can safely assess is that Kovtun was shortchanged and that Plush shouldn't have pushed his body to the point of abuse.

Back to Abbott, I think he would do very well as a choreographer and music consultant for skaters. Starting another career that would utilize his artistic abilities at the level that would satisfy him would be hard.

Agreed.

@Duality - since you feel strongly enough on the subject to have made at least 4 of your in total (so far) 7 posts on the forum on that subject, maybe you should exert yourself further and find those threads?

 

[Ryan O]

Phil Hersh, who wrote a critical column before Worlds on Jeremy's history of bad international performances, said today that he has every right to continue if he wants to and that veterans should not have to retire just cuz the younger guys can't beat them yet. If the younger guys want to earn the spots, they need to prove it by showing they can beat Jeremy.

 

[karne]

Phil Hersh, who wrote a critical column before Worlds on Jeremy's history of bad international performances, said today that he has every right to continue if he wants to and that veterans should not have to retire just cuz the younger guys can't beat them yet. If the younger guys want to earn the spots, they need to prove it by showing they can beat Jeremy.

And generally I agree with this except that I am worried Jeremy's body won't take it. I don't want any more Plushys.

It should also be pointed out that some of the young guys HAVE beaten Jeremy. At Skate Canada, at Nationals, at the Olympics, Jeremy has been beaten by the younger guys.

And none of the younger guys would ever come off the ice after giving up on a short program and say "It was a positive step, it was just a warm-up!"....

 

[centerpt1]

And none of the younger guys would ever come off the ice after giving up on a short program and say "It was a positive step, it was just a warm-up!"....

only because they don't have a sports psychologist feeding them positive self talk

 

[karne]

only because they don't have a sports psychologist feeding them positive self talk

There's a time and a place for telling the press your positive self-talk. When you've just thrown away a short program and screwed over your team...that's not it.

 

[BlackPack]

only because they don't have a sports psychologist feeding them positive self talk

Yeah he sounded like a Polyanna psychologist after the Sochi SP. I may not be Olympic Champion but at least I inspired people to get up when they fall.

I bet so many people puked.

We know this kind of talk is coming out of shrink-sanctioned therapy talk and not from himself which is full of inner demons.

 

[pangtongfan]

Phil Hersh, who wrote a critical column before Worlds on Jeremy's history of bad international performances, said today that he has every right to continue if he wants to and that veterans should not have to retire just cuz the younger guys can't beat them yet. If the younger guys want to earn the spots, they need to prove it by showing they can beat Jeremy.

and he is right. I am tired of hearing this "oh they will hold up Jeremy and send him to worlds over more deserving skaters" garbage. Jeremy has NEVER been held up at Nationals and undeservedly sent to a worlds and Olympics. He missed 2 of the past 4 worlds, what does that tell you, and IMO even one time in 2011 when it was a joke. If he doesnt deliver at Nationals he has never been protected the way some stars might have been.

Meanwhile for the other U.S men if they cant beat a 30 something Jeremy what were they going to do at worlds anyhow. Not to mention Jeremy is the one who just gave the U.S their best worlds finish since....oh yeah Jeremy himself in 2010, and gave the U.S 3 spots back for the first time since.....yes when Jeremy himself led them to that in 2010.

Who is this fabulous cast of up and coming U.S men he would be holding back anyway. I must be in a coma and missed them, as I dont see them. A 30 year old who has never won a world medal, and was beaten out of going to worlds twice in the last 3 years by Ross Miner would never be any kind of an obstacle for a group of skaters who were that promising or uber talented to begin with. The fact is this doesnt even exist. There are some interesting prospects who might have potential, but all are unproven (except Aaron and Brown to a very minor extent) and have a long way to go.

 

[Mrs. P]

Let's not age Jeremy. He is 28, almost 29. That's not 30-something.

It's also not true that Jeremy has not been beaten by younger skaters this season. Jason beat him at the Olympics; Joshua at Skate Canada.
Let's consider the fact that Jeremy's PB is 166+ is not that much higher than Jason Brown's 158+ FS without a quad and with a popped axel and only a few points above Max's 162+ for a FS with several errors from Skate America. And Jason still has the top three highest SP scores among the U.S. men while Jeremy's SP SB is behind Jason, Max Aaron and Adam Rippon.

There's a lot of talent in the U.S. I don't care one way or another whether Jeremy retires or not, but I think he'll have plenty of competition at home if he chooses to remain.

 

[drivingmissdaisy]

If the younger guys want to earn the spots, they need to prove it by showing they can beat Jeremy.

I kind of agree and kind of don't. Jeremy apparently can only peak at either Nationals or Worlds, so if he actually does well at Nationals and stinks at Worlds, it is kind of pointless to send him. (Although, to his credit he did skate well at Nationals and Worlds but was bad at the Olympics.)

 

[BlackPack]

I kind of agree and kind of don't. Jeremy apparently can only peak at either Nationals or Worlds, so if he actually does well at Nationals and stinks at Worlds, it is kind of pointless to send him. (Although, to his credit he did skate well at Nationals and Worlds but was bad at the Olympics.)

Minor point, but I think skating a good LP and a poor SP still doesn't qualify as peaking. He skated his best LP internationally.

I wouldn't throw my weight on Abbott if I were the USFA nor would I consider myself a contender if I were Jeremy.

 

[Ryan O]

Minor point, but I think skating a good LP and a poor SP still doesn't qualify as peaking. He skated his best LP internationally.

I wouldn't throw my weight on Abbott if I were the USFA nor would I consider myself a contender if I were Jeremy.

I think your analysis is realistic.

Although Abbott did 'well' in the sense that he finished 5th at Worlds, that is not really a good enough result at his stage in his career. That's a good result if you are 21 or maybe even 24. But if you are 28 and you still haven't made it to the podium, it's not so good. And look at the point gap. Jeremy was about 30 points out of 3rd place:

1 HANYU - 282.59
2 MACHIDA -282.26
3 FERNANDEZ - 275.93
4 KOVTUN - 247.37
5 ABBOTT - 246.35

http://www.isuresults.com/results/wc2014/CAT001RS.HTM

 

[Meoima]

Although Abbott did 'well' in the sense that he finished 5th at Worlds, that is not really a good enough result at his stage in his career. That's a good result if you are 21 or maybe even 24. But if you are 28 and you still haven't made it to the podium, it's not so good. And look at the point gap. Jeremy was about 30 points out of 3rd place:

Technically I agree that his TES couldn't reach the top 3, but PCS is a different problem. I think Jeremy was so much underscored in PCS. Top 3's PCS should drop 10 points, their skating skills are still nowhere near that score, honestly speaking. Top's 3 PCS is obviously the result of inflations these recent years.

But well, even if we lower their PCS 10 points, they still stay in the top. That wouldn't bring much different but the gap might look less tedious.

However, personally I think Jeremy should have been in the 4th place. Kovtun in the 5th sounds more reasonable.

 

[pangtongfan]

If that matches his lifetime best why wouldnt that be a good result at this stage of his career. Singles skaters dont typically peak at 28, so a 28 year old matching his career best at worlds should be commended and congratulated. And it is not like any other Americans would have ever made the podium at worlds, so he did atleast as well as any hypothetical so and so they might have sent would have. Like I said the only 2 times the U.S men have gotten 3 spots post Lysacek is when Jeremy Abbott was at worlds. 2 out of 3 in fact. Perhaps the USFSA undervalue him and were unwise to not send him to worlds twice, both times when the U.S failed to get 3 men like they have all but once they sent Jeremy.

 

[Ryan O]

Well, Jeremy did finish 4th in the LP, so the judges did acknowledge his strong skate. If he hadn't had the mistake in the SP, he probably would have finished 4th overall. But he still would have had an overall score of somewhere around 250. How does he get into the 275+ range where Fernandez, Machida & Hanyu are? (And if Chan were to come back, it would be even harder to get on the podium).

 

[pangtongfan]

The podium is a real long shot for Jeremy at this point. He would need 2 really strong skates, just not 1. He might need to up his technical content a bit (if that is even possible at this stage). He also would need a season of reasonably consistent skating, making the grand prix final, which would automatically translate to higher PCS and GOE by the judges. The event would probably also have to be not so well skated, which the worlds despite the absences was, atleast by the 3 favorites. The recent worlds was not the norm for mens skating of late, a well skated mens event, so we will see if it the end of the dark age of mens skating (2009-2014 Olympics) or just an aberration.

 

[BlackPack]

To make up the 25-30 points that Fernandez has, Abbott would need 2 quads and more complexity in his programs. Hanyu is unreachable. Although Hanyu still has to develop artistically, he has it all technically. To win bronze at this point would require Abbott to reach a superhuman level on his standards.

While Abbott has a sophisticated, modernist style, his PCS are correctly scored IMO. His choreography is really not as complex and intricate as the other men, nor are his spins, while still wonderful, anywhere near the difficulty, flexibility, and speed of the others.

Or he can hope that all his rivals bomb....

 

[Sandpiper]

Haha, sorry, I had to laugh. The idea of Jeremy Abbott waiting for his competition to bomb so he can turn in two clean, lovely skates... It would be amazing to watch.

Anyway, more on topic, I never got what many people find so artistic about Jeremy's skating. But I don't get the vitriol for him potentially staying in. It's his choice, and if he doesn't want to consider Worlds a high note to go out on... well, it's up to him. Does he have much to lose at this point?