The Journey to replace 20 year old Klingbiels: Advice Solicited

[anomalily]

For those following the journey, I'm replacing 20-year-old Klingbeil skates with new custom skates.

I'm a senior MIF/former novice pairs ice skater now doing ice dance. I have to get customs because of my freakish feet (. But I'm also going to get fun colors because I am an adult who wants to spend her adult money on fun colors. I've mentally prepared myself for a high cost, as I've been putting this off for years.

I went to US nationals to talk with all the skate brands, get fitted, and decide on a new brand. I also visited the Avanta factory, and Will took a cast off my foot (he did say he would share it with another brand if I decided to go with them). I've eliminated Aura, Graf, Edea, and Jackson after talking to them/trying them on. Edea tried to sell me on the idea they could get me into stock boots, which was laughable to anyone else. Harlick is over a year out right now, so I knocked them off too.

I am going for an ice dance boot.

I've narrowed it down to:

Avanta ($1950). 8-12 weeks: Will from Avanta actually made the insoles of my current skates 20 years ago! I think if money were no concern, this would be my preference. I like Will, and I know he’ll make a good boot since he made mine before. Also, he’s young (in the world of skating boots) and invested in the sport and boot-making, so building a relationship with him and investing in his company, especially on the west coast, is valuable to me. But it’s a lot more than the other options. Plus $150 for the holographic leather

SP Teri ($1100 + $99 for fun color leather), 8-10 weeks: If I want nearly identical to Avanta and similar to what I am used to for a lower price, this would be the best option. I think I vibed better with Avanta, though. I am interested in the newer Japanese synthetic leather option SP Teri has. This make is closest to what I am used to.

Riedell ($950), 4-8 weeks: This was a surprise! I got great vibes from the fitter and VP Dan, but I’ve never worn their skates before. He had a lot of great ideas about how to work with my... unique...feet. They can do TONS of custom leathers, but the holographic ones are only for accents. All customs are $950, all in, for every change, including putting initials on the side of the boot and such (he showed me some cute skates he just made for Johnny weir with his dog's face embroidered on them.)

I’ve worn both Klingbiel (essentially the precursor to Avanta) and SP Teri. Additionally, many people involved in my Klingbiel boots are now at SP Teri and Avanta. So my significant hesitation with Riedell is I've never worn their boots before. Also, maybe I should spend some of my money on investing in Avanta's growth as a small skating business?

Also: I heard some drama about Karen Chen and Avanta a few years back, and I don't want to work with a company that would trash a teenager on social media. But I can't tell who was at the helm of Avanta at the time, given that Bill from SP Teri used to be the Avanta president.

THOUGHTS? Experiences with customs from any of the above? Any tea on the Chen/Avanta drama?

ETA: My particular unique issues are DDDD width feet with a AAA heel and protruding Achilles, bone spurs and bunions on both feet, arthritic hammertoes, weird ankle bone and different size feet.

 

[christy]

I can't help with personal experience of the brands you are considering, but definitely agree with the decision to not go with Aura. I tried them and the boots they made were totally wrong. They were much too large and when I measured the insole it was 15mm longer than my foot!
I'm currently trying to decide what to do next, and whilst I don't have a Riedell foot I've read really great things about their customs and if I could travel to them or find a good rep for them then I would go with them. I've read mixed opinions of Avanta, and the price point is a deal breaker, and my only experience of SP Teris is trying a pair about 20 years ago, but my feet issues are very different to yours. Good luck, and let us know how it goes with your decision please.

 

[anomalily]

definitely agree with the decision to not go with Aura. I tried them and the boots they made were totally wrong. They were much too large and when I measured the insole it was 15mm longer than my foot!

Yea, the thing I'll say about Aura: they seem to be the only brand that is not respected by their peers in the custom boot-making world. I had many long conversations with the reps from all the brands, and consistently they were gentlemen about their competitors. However, Aura seemed to be the odd one out and I don't get the impression it is because they are "revolutionary" as they claimed...it appears they are maybe out of their depth in an industry that takes a lot of time to build skill in

 

[Ic3Rabbit]

For those following the journey, I'm replacing 20-year-old Klingbeil skates with new custom skates.

I'm a senior MIF/former novice pairs ice skater now doing ice dance. I have to get customs because of my freakish feet (. But I'm also going to get fun colors because I am an adult who wants to spend her adult money on fun colors. I've mentally prepared myself for a high cost, as I've been putting this off for years.

I went to US nationals to talk with all the skate brands, get fitted, and decide on a new brand. I also visited the Avanta factory, and Will took a cast off my foot (he did say he would share it with another brand if I decided to go with them). I've eliminated Aura, Graf, Edea, and Jackson after talking to them/trying them on. Edea tried to sell me on the idea they could get me into stock boots, which was laughable to anyone else. Harlick is over a year out right now, so I knocked them off too.

I am going for an ice dance boot.

I've narrowed it down to:

Avanta ($1950). 8-12 weeks: Will from Avanta actually made the insoles of my current skates 20 years ago! I think if money were no concern, this would be my preference. I like Will, and I know he’ll make a good boot since he made mine before. Also, he’s young (in the world of skating boots) and invested in the sport and boot-making, so building a relationship with him and investing in his company, especially on the west coast, is valuable to me. But it’s a lot more than the other options. Plus $150 for the holographic leather

SP Teri ($1100 + $99 for fun color leather), 8-10 weeks: If I want nearly identical to Avanta and similar to what I am used to for a lower price, this would be the best option. I think I vibed better with Avanta, though. I am interested in the newer Japanese synthetic leather option SP Teri has. This make is closest to what I am used to.

Riedell ($950), 4-8 weeks: This was a surprise! I got great vibes from the fitter and VP Dan, but I’ve never worn their skates before. He had a lot of great ideas about how to work with my... unique...feet. They can do TONS of custom leathers, but the holographic ones are only for accents. All customs are $950, all in, for every change, including putting initials on the side of the boot and such (he showed me some cute skates he just made for Johnny weir with his dog's face embroidered on them.)

I’ve worn both Klingbiel (essentially the precursor to Avanta) and SP Teri. Additionally, many people involved in my Klingbiel boots are now at SP Teri and Avanta. So my significant hesitation with Riedell is I've never worn their boots before. Also, maybe I should spend some of my money on investing in Avanta's growth as a small skating business?

Also: I heard some drama about Karen Chen and Avanta a few years back, and I don't want to work with a company that would trash a teenager on social media. But I can't tell who was at the helm of Avanta at the time, given that Bill from SP Teri used to be the Avanta president.

THOUGHTS? Experiences with customs from any of the above? Any tea on the Chen/Avanta drama?

ETA: My particular unique issues are DDDD width feet with a AAA heel and protruding Achilles, bone spurs and bunions on both feet, arthritic hammertoes, weird ankle bone and different size feet.

Hi and welcome from a former Senior elite now pro (singles and dance), who has just as crazy feet from all the years of competing and being in boots. I too many years ago wore custom Klingbeil and miss them dearly. I now have worn Risport for years now, and before that went between Riedell custom and Jackson. Have you considered Risport?!

 

[anomalily]

Hi and welcome from a former Senior elite now pro (singles and dance), who has just as crazy feet from all the years of competing and being in boots. I too many years ago wore custom Klingbeil and miss them dearly. I now have worn Risport for years now, and before that went between Riedell custom and Jackson. Have you considered Risport?!

Hi! Glad to see another Klingbeil fan! I did talk briefly with Risport at Nationals this past weekend, but I don't think they'll work for my feet and ended up kicking them out of the running pretty early. I forgot to put them in top listing though!

 

[mskater93]

For those following the journey, I'm replacing 20-year-old Klingbeil skates with new custom skates.

I'm a senior MIF/former novice pairs ice skater now doing ice dance. I have to get customs because of my freakish feet (. But I'm also going to get fun colors because I am an adult who wants to spend her adult money on fun colors. I've mentally prepared myself for a high cost, as I've been putting this off for years.

I went to US nationals to talk with all the skate brands, get fitted, and decide on a new brand. I also visited the Avanta factory, and Will took a cast off my foot (he did say he would share it with another brand if I decided to go with them). I've eliminated Aura, Graf, Edea, and Jackson after talking to them/trying them on. Edea tried to sell me on the idea they could get me into stock boots, which was laughable to anyone else. Harlick is over a year out right now, so I knocked them off too.

I am going for an ice dance boot.

I've narrowed it down to:

Avanta ($1950). 8-12 weeks: Will from Avanta actually made the insoles of my current skates 20 years ago! I think if money were no concern, this would be my preference. I like Will, and I know he’ll make a good boot since he made mine before. Also, he’s young (in the world of skating boots) and invested in the sport and boot-making, so building a relationship with him and investing in his company, especially on the west coast, is valuable to me. But it’s a lot more than the other options. Plus $150 for the holographic leather

SP Teri ($1100 + $99 for fun color leather), 8-10 weeks: If I want nearly identical to Avanta and similar to what I am used to for a lower price, this would be the best option. I think I vibed better with Avanta, though. I am interested in the newer Japanese synthetic leather option SP Teri has. This make is closest to what I am used to.

Riedell ($950), 4-8 weeks: This was a surprise! I got great vibes from the fitter and VP Dan, but I’ve never worn their skates before. He had a lot of great ideas about how to work with my... unique...feet. They can do TONS of custom leathers, but the holographic ones are only for accents. All customs are $950, all in, for every change, including putting initials on the side of the boot and such (he showed me some cute skates he just made for Johnny weir with his dog's face embroidered on them.)

I’ve worn both Klingbiel (essentially the precursor to Avanta) and SP Teri. Additionally, many people involved in my Klingbiel boots are now at SP Teri and Avanta. So my significant hesitation with Riedell is I've never worn their boots before. Also, maybe I should spend some of my money on investing in Avanta's growth as a small skating business?

Also: I heard some drama about Karen Chen and Avanta a few years back, and I don't want to work with a company that would trash a teenager on social media. But I can't tell who was at the helm of Avanta at the time, given that Bill from SP Teri used to be the Avanta president.

THOUGHTS? Experiences with customs from any of the above? Any tea on the Chen/Avanta drama?

ETA: My particular unique issues are DDDD width feet with a AAA heel and protruding Achilles, bone spurs and bunions on both feet, arthritic hammertoes, weird ankle bone and different size feet.

PM me for the Avanta/Karen Chen story. Not something I'd share publicly.

 

[Ic3Rabbit]

PM me for the Avanta/Karen Chen story. Not something I'd share publicly.

We've already discussed it via PM due to the same reasons!

 

[mskater93]

We've already discussed it via PM due to the same reasons!

Thank you

 

[mtvessel]

Nothing to add, other than to say I'm intensely interested how this all works out for you. Thanks for posting your journey! My 21-year old Klingbeils are still in good shape (thanks to a long ice absence), but eventually I'm going to have to move on. I thought I'd read somewhere that Will still had all the old Klingbeil lasts. Do you know if that's true? Even if it is, I wonder if it's advisable to use something based on how my feet were 20 years ago. OTOH, the boots still fit me well.

Please keep us updated!

 

[anomalily]

I thought I'd read somewhere that Will still had all the old Klingbeil lasts

There are definitely quite a few of the older ones in the factory and I heard that from another customer. You'd have to ask about yours directly.

My 21-year old Klingbeils are still in good shape (thanks to a long ice absence)

I took 15 years off, but I was a pairs skater jumping triples before I left, so they wore down fast. They're only working out as well as they are because I don't really jump more than an occasional double loop these days. Everyone who saw how broken down they were surprised I could jump on them at all.

 

[christy]

Yea, the thing I'll say about Aura: they seem to be the only brand that is not respected by their peers in the custom boot-making world. I had many long conversations with the reps from all the brands, and consistently they were gentlemen about their competitors. However, Aura seemed to be the odd one out and I don't get the impression it is because they are "revolutionary" as they claimed...it appears they are maybe out of their depth in an industry that takes a lot of time to build skill in

iirc they started with hockey skates and are basically 3D printing boots then it's really up to the fitters to make them work so they're really not custom. They seem to take the view that if the first version doesn't work they can keep reprinting until they get something viable, but when they confirmed they had made the boots >15mm bigger than the measurements that didn't inspire faith in their abilities. In addition to the random sizing I thought the quality of the boots was extremely poor.

 

[Ic3Rabbit]

Nothing to add, other than to say I'm intensely interested how this all works out for you. Thanks for posting your journey! My 21-year old Klingbeils are still in good shape (thanks to a long ice absence), but eventually I'm going to have to move on. I thought I'd read somewhere that Will still had all the old Klingbeil lasts. Do you know if that's true? Even if it is, I wonder if it's advisable to use something based on how my feet were 20 years ago. OTOH, the boots still fit me well.

Please keep us updated!

Your feet has more than likely changed in 20 years and may not (most likely) not fit boots the same.

 

[MCsAngel2]

I really want you to keep us updated on how this turns out for you. I'm not sure what I would do in your position. Personally, I wear Jackson, but I've always had a nagging thought that I'd like to try Riedells again (my skate when I skated in the 80s). I like the traditional construction, I like how they look and I love the lower heel. However, my feet have grown in all directions and that is why I'm wearing an EE in Jacksons even though I still have arch pain even with the black Superfeet. The toes seem too roomy but Riedell is a lower volume boot and I just don't know if they are suitable for my middle aged feet anymore.

I'd be hesitant about SP Teri because they were having staff problems awhile ago (had lost a stitcher I think), and after their site sustained damage in that storm...in 2020? I don't remember...it just seemed like they were disorganized. If you can find anyone who's gotten some recently, then yeah, maybe. But for me it'd be between Avanta and Riedell.

Where do you live? Could you go to either site in person? (Wouldn't you have to go to Avanta to get the casts done?)

There are aspects of Avantas that I don't care for, whereas I love the look of Riedells, and that is coloring my opinion. But if your goal is to get something closest to your Klingbeils, then it seems that Avanta is your best bet, as long as they are constructed the same way (which I question as they look different). If the construction is different, then I would choose whichever of them you live closest to/are best able to visit in person. I think that needs to be part of your cost consideration. As an older adult with weird feet that you need totally custom boots for, I think they need to see and measure your feet in person.

 

[anomalily]

Wouldn't you have to go to Avanta to get the casts done?)

I already got a cast done at Avanta (I went to the factory in person) and they offered to share it with another maker if I didn't go with them- I got fitted by every brand this past weekend at nationals.

'd be hesitant about SP Teri because they were having staff problems awhile ago (had lost a stitcher I think), and after their site sustained damage in that storm...in 2020?

I got to hear all about that from Bill... he at least sounds like they're back up to speed but I'm a bit concerned because it seems like they have an awful lot going on lol.

I'll definitely keep you updated.

 

[starryskate]

I don't trust Aura. I once tried their hockey boots for fun and you need to twist your ankle to get in and out of them. They're just weirdly designed. And what does a speed skater know about hockey or figure anyway?

 

[anomalily]

Of note: I sent a picture of my bare feet side-by-side with the boot casts to my Figure Skating group chat. Today at the rink, one of the people on the group chat said to me, "Once I saw that picture of your feet...I thought, 'oh you can take all the time you need to get skates'. You've got very unique feet."

 

[starryskate]

Of note: I sent a picture of my bare feet side-by-side with the boot casts to my Figure Skating group chat. Today at the rink, one of the people on the group chat said to me, "Once I saw that picture of your feet...I thought, 'oh you can take all the time you need to get skates'. You've got very unique feet."

Not to sound creepy, but now I want to see them.

 

[anomalily]

Not to sound creepy, but now I want to see them.

I'd put them on the internet, but it's 2023 and I've learned not to give the dogs away for free.

 

[Ic3Rabbit]

I don't trust Aura. I once tried their hockey boots for fun and you need to twist your ankle to get in and out of them. They're just weirdly designed. And what does a speed skater know about hockey or figure anyway?

I am not a fan of Aura, but their figure skate boots are advised by pro figure skaters such as Vaughn Chipeur. Last I knew, Nam Nguyen was wearing the brand, as were others.

 

[anomalily]

I'm using this thread as a journal and hope no one disapproves. No one else in my life cares about this, but I want to document it and solicit any insight

I'm pretty sure I'm choosing Riedells, but now I have to call Will and ask for the cast to be sent to Riedell, which of course, I don't want to do. I think if the price was closer, I'd choose Avanta, but Riedell is gonna give me a good boot (I hope) for half the price.

Now what is left to do is a long, long list:
- Boot Type - synchro/ice dance situation is likely because I still want to jump occasionally but would love to have blades that are shorter and better optimized for ice dance and be able to point my toe more easily
- Tongue type - currently have half wool/half open-cell foam but considering the closed cell foam
- Heel height - currently have 1 3/4", might consider a 2"
- Cut Outs - Decide if I should do cut-outs for my bone spurs as I saw riedell does (the slits might be better)
- Blade Type - currently liking MK Dynasty synchro blade but have no idea honestly

And then the big one: I have to choose colors. Currently, I am in tan (falling apart) boots with black blades—because I wasn't allowed to get black boots because "black is for boys." Gender norms around footwear color have slightly improved in the interceding 21 years. But also I'm not competing so I don't need to get black OR tan OR white.

I am and adult and this is my fun, expensive adult hobby. I would like to get something FUN that reminds me I DO THIS FOR FUN.

I am leaning towards pink suede with holographic leather for the accents (back stripe and middle tongue), trying to decide if I should do a cut-out on the side. Also...considering the possibility of doing a split color - one-half teal, one-half pink? Essentially the bi-pride flag but in skates? This is quad skate, obviously, but they are generally more fun, so I'm looking at them for inspo.

I heard they can do color bottoms but apparently not the Louboutin red? Johnny Weir used to get that on his skates according to Riedell and apparently the color is trademarked I am thinking color on the bottom is an issue though for the possible adult synchro team we're forming here...at least pink skates I can cover with tights. Pink soles I cannot.