Boot help | Golden Skate

Boot help

Newbieskatingmom

Rinkside
Joined
Mar 25, 2018
My toddler son is taking lessons so I thought to join him on the ice a few weeks ago. I bought some boots for myself, Jackson Freestyle, because they looked comfortable. I was fitted by the skate technician at the rink, I’m not sure what his expertise is in fitting figure skates as it’s a rink that primarily caters to hockey. I’ve put in about 40 hours or so on the ice in my boots (I’m solidly in Basic 6, so not talking about doing any crazy advanced jumps or spins) and I’m starting to suspect that they’re not the right size. They’re creasing on the outsides even though I’m not that heavy (5’5 and 120 lbs) and definitely don’t skate with a lot of power. Is this normal?

https://imgur.com/a/dpS4UfR

I have to tie them so tight that my laces are already fraying slightly because otherwise it feels like my feet are moving up and down in them. I can fit one index finger behind my heel when my foot is in the boot and they’re unlaced. Also, I’m pronating my feet inward slightly, even though I’m usually pronating heavily outward in sneakers. I’m also unable to find the “sweet spot” on my blade with any consistency, i feel like I have to get on toes and press down, if that makes sense, instead of being on the ball of my foot. The width seems fine, I think maybe the issue is length? I’m a sneaker size 9.5 and the boots are a 9. I’ve attached a photo of where my toes have left their mark on the insole.

https://imgur.com/a/ql86g3Y

I have tried insoles but they don’t seem to do much. Maybe double socks would help? Is this even a big deal? I’m thinking it’s maybe a half a size difference. Should I just suck it up and keep using them until they fall apart? Or am I creating a headache for myself in that i will have to relearn skills once I get properly fitting boots?
 

Ic3Rabbit

Former Elite, now Pro. ⛸️
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 9, 2017
Country
Olympics
My toddler son is taking lessons so I thought to join him on the ice a few weeks ago. I bought some boots for myself, Jackson Freestyle, because they looked comfortable. I was fitted by the skate technician at the rink, I’m not sure what his expertise is in fitting figure skates as it’s a rink that primarily caters to hockey. I’ve put in about 40 hours or so on the ice in my boots (I’m solidly in Basic 6, so not talking about doing any crazy advanced jumps or spins) and I’m starting to suspect that they’re not the right size. They’re creasing on the outsides even though I’m not that heavy (5’5 and 120 lbs) and definitely don’t skate with a lot of power. Is this normal?

https://imgur.com/a/dpS4UfR

I have to tie them so tight that my laces are already fraying slightly because otherwise it feels like my feet are moving up and down in them. I can fit one index finger behind my heel when my foot is in the boot and they’re unlaced. Also, I’m pronating my feet inward slightly, even though I’m usually pronating heavily outward in sneakers. I’m also unable to find the “sweet spot” on my blade with any consistency, i feel like I have to get on toes and press down, if that makes sense, instead of being on the ball of my foot. The width seems fine, I think maybe the issue is length? I’m a sneaker size 9.5 and the boots are a 9. I’ve attached a photo of where my toes have left their mark on the insole.

https://imgur.com/a/ql86g3Y

I have tried insoles but they don’t seem to do much. Maybe double socks would help? Is this even a big deal? I’m thinking it’s maybe a half a size difference. Should I just suck it up and keep using them until they fall apart? Or am I creating a headache for myself in that i will have to relearn skills once I get properly fitting boots?

They sound like they don't fit properly and aren't the proper stiffness of boot for you anyway (because you said they are creasing).

I would find a pro fitter that isn't at your rink, someone that only does this and knows what they are talking about. And have them measure you, take outlines of your foot etc.
You are going to need new boots and proper ones at that.

Good luck!:biggrin:
 

vlaurend

Final Flight
Joined
Jan 14, 2008
Yep! You called it! They're too long for you, and the result is that your heel is sliding up and down, which is kind of dangerous. Also, if your boots are too long, the sweet spot of the blade won't be under the ball of your foot. And boots that are too big break down sooner. You only have one pair of feet and you are paying for the ice time, so I personally wouldn't waste my time, money or feet trying to skate in boots that don't let you skate properly. Invest in some boots that fit in the length, ball width and heel width. It may cost more, but it's important.
 

Newbieskatingmom

Rinkside
Joined
Mar 25, 2018
They sound like they don't fit properly and aren't the proper stiffness of boot for you anyway (because you said they are creasing).

I would find a pro fitter that isn't at your rink, someone that only does this and knows what they are talking about. And have them measure you, take outlines of your foot etc.
You are going to need new boots and proper ones at that.

Good luck!:biggrin:

Well, they don’t feel like they’re creasing while I’m wearing them, the only thing I’ve noticed is my foot kind of sliding around unless they’re tied very tight, but I’ve noticed the creasing on the outside of the boots, that’s what I was trying to show in the photo link. I thought maybe it was a sign they’re breaking in but looking around today, I didn’t notice anyone else had that crease on the outside of their boot, even the much more advanced ladies who had older skates. Also, can they really be breaking down after only 40 hours or so of basic skills? I was told that adult skaters doing single and double jumps can make a boot last at least a year, I was expecting with my little bunny hops and waltz jumps that these boots would last me at least 2 years? I’m certainly not opposed to new boots but this seems so fast to me.

Unfortunately we are short on knowledgeable skate techs around here, I might have to resort to drawing an outline of my foot and contacting Jackson directly and working with them online.
 

Ic3Rabbit

Former Elite, now Pro. ⛸️
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 9, 2017
Country
Olympics
Well, they don’t feel like they’re creasing while I’m wearing them, the only thing I’ve noticed is my foot kind of sliding around unless they’re tied very tight, but I’ve noticed the creasing on the outside of the boots, that’s what I was trying to show in the photo link. I thought maybe it was a sign they’re breaking in but looking around today, I didn’t notice anyone else had that crease on the outside of their boot, even the much more advanced ladies who had older skates. Also, can they really be breaking down after only 40 hours or so of basic skills? I was told that adult skaters doing single and double jumps can make a boot last at least a year, I was expecting with my little bunny hops and waltz jumps that these boots would last me at least 2 years? I’m certainly not opposed to new boots but this seems so fast to me.

Unfortunately we are short on knowledgeable skate techs around here, I might have to resort to drawing an outline of my foot and contacting Jackson directly and working with them online.

They are breaking down. You don't have the proper fit and the proper boot for you so they are going to do that much faster than people who have the correct boot and fit for them.
 

Newbieskatingmom

Rinkside
Joined
Mar 25, 2018
They are breaking down. You don't have the proper fit and the proper boot for you so they are going to do that much faster than people who have the correct boot and fit for them.

I see, thanks. Looks like I’ll have to start hunting for new boots. Would it be crazy for me to look at a boot that’s a bit stiffer than the Freestyle? I’ve been reading about overbooting but I’m unclear if that applies only to growing kids or adults as well? I’d like a boot to last a year or two ideally, I don’t plan on doing a lot of jumping, I’ll probably switch to dance after I go through some of the free skate levels, I’m too old for too much jumping anyway! Haha.
 

Ic3Rabbit

Former Elite, now Pro. ⛸️
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 9, 2017
Country
Olympics
I see, thanks. Looks like I’ll have to start hunting for new boots. Would it be crazy for me to look at a boot that’s a bit stiffer than the Freestyle? I’ve been reading about overbooting but I’m unclear if that applies only to growing kids or adults as well? I’d like a boot to last a year or two ideally, I don’t plan on doing a lot of jumping, I’ll probably switch to dance after I go through some of the free skate levels, I’m too old for too much jumping anyway! Haha.

Yes, and in order to stay with Jacksons if they work for you, you're going to have to go with a separate boot and blade.
Also, know that dance boots are different in several ways, as are their blades.
 

Newbieskatingmom

Rinkside
Joined
Mar 25, 2018
Yes, and in order to stay with Jacksons if they work for you, you're going to have to go with a separate boot and blade.
Also, know that dance boots are different in several ways, as are their blades.

Will I need a dance boot and blade? Or can I just stick with freestyle boots and an intermediate freestyle blade like the coronation Ace or something similar?
 

Ic3Rabbit

Former Elite, now Pro. ⛸️
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 9, 2017
Country
Olympics
Will I need a dance boot and blade? Or can I just stick with freestyle boots and an intermediate freestyle blade like the coronation Ace or something similar?

Do you have a coach you can talk to about these things? And find out what their opinion is.
 

Ange

Rinkside
Joined
Jan 4, 2018
To OP, it does look like they’re the wrong size and possibly stiffness. I had this issue with my first pair and my skating did improve dramatically after getting proper boots because my foot wasn’t sliding down anymore.

If your laces are tied really tight and narrow so that the lace eyelets are really close together, the skates are probably too wide as well.

Skate lacing should be relatively far apart like this:
https://goo.gl/images/AwQbB3

Not super narrow like this (these were the closest pictures I could find to demonstrate what I mean):
https://goo.gl/images/GqL6Yw

The best way to explain well-fitting skates is that they should fit like a glove. You should be able to feel all the sides of the boot (your foot should touch the front of the boot, the sides, and all around the heel cup) without your foot being crammed in.

I agree with all the other guidance above as well :)

I would recommend to contact each manufacturer directly to determine your size. However, when I did the same thing, they told me that foot outlines tend to be distorted when sent electronically, so you need to give them measurements in millimetres. Measure the length and width of your foot in thin skating socks and send these measurements through to them. They will be able to determine your size. There are lots of sites that show how to measure your foot for skate fitting :)

Also, once you know what size you are in a particular brand, have a look at that manufacturer’s width chart online to see if the width of that size boot suits you. Brands differ in terms of width, so your best bet would be to determine which brand most closely suits your width once you know your size in that brand.

Hope this helps and all makes sense! Good luck!
 

Newbieskatingmom

Rinkside
Joined
Mar 25, 2018
To OP, it does look like they’re the wrong size and possibly stiffness. I had this issue with my first pair and my skating did improve dramatically after getting proper boots because my foot wasn’t sliding down anymore.

If your laces are tied really tight and narrow so that the lace eyelets are really close together, the skates are probably too wide as well.

Skate lacing should be relatively far apart like this:
https://goo.gl/images/AwQbB3

Not super narrow like this (these were the closest pictures I could find to demonstrate what I mean):
https://goo.gl/images/GqL6Yw

The best way to explain well-fitting skates is that they should fit like a glove. You should be able to feel all the sides of the boot (your foot should touch the front of the boot, the sides, and all around the heel cup) without your foot being crammed in.

I agree with all the other guidance above as well :)

I would recommend to contact each manufacturer directly to determine your size. However, when I did the same thing, they told me that foot outlines tend to be distorted when sent electronically, so you need to give them measurements in millimetres. Measure the length and width of your foot in thin skating socks and send these measurements through to them. They will be able to determine your size. There are lots of sites that show how to measure your foot for skate fitting :)

Also, once you know what size you are in a particular brand, have a look at that manufacturer’s width chart online to see if the width of that size boot suits you. Brands differ in terms of width, so your best bet would be to determine which brand most closely suits your width once you know your size in that brand.

Hope this helps and all makes sense! Good luck!

Thanks for this, do you mean I should go up a stiffness level? I went with the Freestyle because I was told they are rated for up to single jumps, I’m not doing more than bunny hops and waltz jumps. In terms of width, I do have a wide foot but now that I think about it, the skate tech never measured my foot width, he just automatically ordered the D width because I told him I wear a wide size in sneakers. My boots look like a mix of both those photos, they get pretty narrow around my ankle area where the crease on my skate is. My foot is wide near my toes and ball of my foot and narrows towards my heels, my heels are very narrow and I often slip out of sneakers. Thanks for this info, I’ll contact Jackson today and see if they can help.
 

Nimyue

On the Ice
Joined
May 15, 2018
Ah, okay, thanks for confirming. So I’m not crazy! Haha. I was thinking maybe that since I’m not an advanced or expert skater that maybe they’re meant to crease like that on the boot or be a little longer on the insole, but they’ve felt so “off”. Bummer, it feels like I just threw away $300, but lesson learned! We don’t have any knowledgeable skate techs around us, how bad would it be to draw the outline of my foot and email it to a place like Kinzies Closet or Jackson directly and see if they can help me? Am I dooming myself to another pair of ill-fitting skates?

For what it's worth, I went to Kinzie's. On her website she had call with sizing issues, and I didn't call the first time. I should have. Anyway, Jennifer is really really lovely. From a quick glance at your insole, I'd assume your skates are at least 1 size too long. Kinzie's has great measurement information on the website, BUT if you have a proshop, see if they have the wooden slide measure. It's much easier to measure your feet with those things. Even a shoe store will have one. Then take your measurements (include width) and call. Kinzie's will do 1 size return you are just out shipping which costs about $20. But if you get a good measurement and use her info, you could always go to your proshop and have them order the size you determined as they might have a better size exhange policy.

I've determined that I'm driving 4 hours for my next pair though. It's totally worth it. It might seem like a pain but if you get a proper fitting and great skates, you're set for 3-5 years. Is there a proshop you could go to that's a weekend trip?
 

Newbieskatingmom

Rinkside
Joined
Mar 25, 2018
To OP, it does look like they’re the wrong size and possibly stiffness. I had this issue with my first pair and my skating did improve dramatically after getting proper boots because my foot wasn’t sliding down anymore.

If your laces are tied really tight and narrow so that the lace eyelets are really close together, the skates are probably too wide as well.

Skate lacing should be relatively far apart like this:
https://goo.gl/images/AwQbB3

Not super narrow like this (these were the closest pictures I could find to demonstrate what I mean):
https://goo.gl/images/GqL6Yw

The best way to explain well-fitting skates is that they should fit like a glove. You should be able to feel all the sides of the boot (your foot should touch the front of the boot, the sides, and all around the heel cup) without your foot being crammed in.

I agree with all the other guidance above as well :)

I would recommend to contact each manufacturer directly to determine your size. However, when I did the same thing, they told me that foot outlines tend to be distorted when sent electronically, so you need to give them measurements in millimetres. Measure the length and width of your foot in thin skating socks and send these measurements through to them. They will be able to determine your size. There are lots of sites that show how to measure your foot for skate fitting :)

Also, once you know what size you are in a particular brand, have a look at that manufacturer’s width chart online to see if the width of that size boot suits you. Brands differ in terms of width, so your best bet would be to determine which brand most closely suits your width once you know your size in that brand.

Hope this helps and all makes sense! Good luck!

Okay, so I took a photo of my skates on, this is what they look like laced. Are these too close together? I have to really pull them together, otherwise my foot slides around. I take it that maybe I also do have a width issue as well...


https://imgur.com/a/f3MzJug
 

RoaringMice

On the Ice
Joined
Aug 1, 2003
Jacksons should perhaps fit you, as they have a wider forefoot and a narrower heel naturally. The guy at the pro shop was not helpful, because he didn't measure your actual foot width and compare it to Jackson, he just automatically ordered you a D width. Maybe a D width in a size lower would work, or maybe you fit a normal Jackson width in a lower size, but that guy wasn't helping you with this.

If you're willing to let us know where you are (just a state is fine), we may know a good skate pro near there you can go see. You might also try asking the skating school director at your rink.
 

silver.blades

Medalist
Joined
Jan 4, 2007
Country
Canada
Will I need a dance boot and blade? Or can I just stick with freestyle boots and an intermediate freestyle blade like the coronation Ace or something similar?

You can do dance almost as well with a freeskate boot and blade as with a dance one. Dance boots tend to have a lower cut on the ankle and are much lower in the back to allow for easier toe point. The blades are much shorter, with less aggressive and more toe picks. The rocker is also more intense, or at least feels that way because of the smaller toe picks.

For your level, it comes down to what your comfortable in. I achieved my Gold level dances and was working on some of the senior competitive ones in freeskate skates. I've since switched to dance skates as I'm not allowed to jump any more and needed to avoid temptation. Free skates are more stable, but dance skates really let you get into the ice and you can achieve much tighter edges than in free skate boots.
 

Nimyue

On the Ice
Joined
May 15, 2018
Okay, so I took a photo of my skates on, this is what they look like laced. Are these too close together? I have to really pull them together, otherwise my foot slides around. I take it that maybe I also do have a width issue as well...


https://imgur.com/a/f3MzJug

If you look at the jackson size chart, the smaller sizes have smaller widths. So you still might need a wide in the proper length. Or maybe you need a regular width. You need to measure your length and width and compare it to the chart.

https://www.kinziescloset.com/jackson-sizing-chart.html
 

Ic3Rabbit

Former Elite, now Pro. ⛸️
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 9, 2017
Country
Olympics
RE: Dance boot and blades.


If you are going to be doing partnered dances in the future, the recommendation is to get dance boots and blades so you aren't hitting and tangling blades with your partner, it's also going to help you achieve more success in the patterns and the real feel of ice dance (also dance blades have different less defined toe picks so they don't catch like freestyle blades will in dances). But you won't need them until that point (if you choose to do that), for now you should be good in freestyle boots/blades.


Good luck whatever you decide.
 

Ange

Rinkside
Joined
Jan 4, 2018
Thanks for this, do you mean I should go up a stiffness level? I went with the Freestyle because I was told they are rated for up to single jumps, I’m not doing more than bunny hops and waltz jumps. In terms of width, I do have a wide foot but now that I think about it, the skate tech never measured my foot width, he just automatically ordered the D width because I told him I wear a wide size in sneakers. My boots look like a mix of both those photos, they get pretty narrow around my ankle area where the crease on my skate is. My foot is wide near my toes and ball of my foot and narrows towards my heels, my heels are very narrow and I often slip out of sneakers. Thanks for this info, I’ll contact Jackson today and see if they can help.

Okay, so I took a photo of my skates on, this is what they look like laced. Are these too close together? I have to really pull them together, otherwise my foot slides around. I take it that maybe I also do have a width issue as well...


https://imgur.com/a/f3MzJug

Unfortunately, I haven't been skating for years, so perhaps someone else might be able to look at the photo and be able to tell. They don't look as bad as my first pair did through the forefoot, but as you said they don't look quite right through the ankle. From my experience with less than optimal skates, this is likely a width issue. Do you find that your heel sits in the heel cup nicely or is there space around your heel? That would be width - if you feel like you really have to strap your foot in with tight lacing.

If they don't fit right, it's hard to tell whether they are a good stiffness level because if they're too wide they will likely crease badly at the ankle anyway when you bend your knees. And it will be hard to tell if you have enough support because a well-fitting pair will provide better support. It's a good idea to speak to your coach about the stiffness level they recommend. I'm at the same level as you, but I had to go for a higher stiffness because of an injury I had a couple years ago, so my muscles around my feet and ankles aren't as strong as they should be. That's why I needed a bit of extra support from the boot and my coach recommended a higher stiffness level. But you and your coach are going to be the best judges of how much support you need. I think it's probably best to speak with them about your goals and see what they say.
 

Newbieskatingmom

Rinkside
Joined
Mar 25, 2018
For what it's worth, I went to Kinzie's. On her website she had call with sizing issues, and I didn't call the first time. I should have. Anyway, Jennifer is really really lovely. From a quick glance at your insole, I'd assume your skates are at least 1 size too long. Kinzie's has great measurement information on the website, BUT if you have a proshop, see if they have the wooden slide measure. It's much easier to measure your feet with those things. Even a shoe store will have one. Then take your measurements (include width) and call. Kinzie's will do 1 size return you are just out shipping which costs about $20. But if you get a good measurement and use her info, you could always go to your proshop and have them order the size you determined as they might have a better size exhange policy.

I've determined that I'm driving 4 hours for my next pair though. It's totally worth it. It might seem like a pain but if you get a proper fitting and great skates, you're set for 3-5 years. Is there a proshop you could go to that's a weekend trip?

I went to a different pro shop today and got a fitting. It looks like my skates are half a size too big in length and the wrong width. In Jackson I am a 8.5 and a split width with the ball of my foot measuring C/D with toes that slope down (Greek toes, is what they call them) and my heel measuring AA. Currently I’m in a Jackson size 9 wide so hence the ankle instability and creasing and feeling like my toe box is too big and my heels are slipping. I actually live a few hours away from Kinzies but sadly it looks like they’re online only. I so wish I could go and try on all their boot options! But I will give them a call after this long weekend because the pro shop lady, who stocks only Jackson and Reidells, said maybe Jackson might not be the best boot for me.
 

Newbieskatingmom

Rinkside
Joined
Mar 25, 2018
Jacksons should perhaps fit you, as they have a wider forefoot and a narrower heel naturally. The guy at the pro shop was not helpful, because he didn't measure your actual foot width and compare it to Jackson, he just automatically ordered you a D width. Maybe a D width in a size lower would work, or maybe you fit a normal Jackson width in a lower size, but that guy wasn't helping you with this.

If you're willing to let us know where you are (just a state is fine), we may know a good skate pro near there you can go see. You might also try asking the skating school director at your rink.

I’m in Georgia and it looks like Kinzies is the place here that everyone refers to, but it’s not an actual pro shop, just online. The pro shops here stock Jackson and Reidell and while the lady I spoke to today was extremely knowledgeable, she did say maybe Jackson wasn’t the right option for me. I wish we had somewhere to go that stocks boots from a variety of manufacturers that I could actually try on. She did say maybe I should look into Edea (with the caveat that they lack support for high arches so I’d need orthotics) but those seem so advanced! The stiffness of my Freestyles is okay but I’m a 8.5 in Jackson and the ball of my foot is a C/D and my heel is AA. I also have high arches. The Jacksons i have now are just too wide, don’t fit my heel at all even after heat molding and a half size too large. She said the problem with ordering a split width is that the boots at that level are stiffer.
 
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