2018 GP Helsinki Free Dance

[Mrs. P]

KevinVchicago and Mrs. P , thanks for moral support of my imaginary for now decision of going to IdF, I am crazy inside out making it up right now, but I am so tempted to do it...

Yolo, Yolo! You need to see G/P again! And I need a live report of Jason! We’ve had someone from here see him live at all two events so far lol.

 

[Baron Vladimir]

It honestly feels like Krylova is spending her time since she became a coach making programs for...Krylova. That program would have been a big hit...back in the early 90s.

Well, it still stands out, not because it is that special, but because many other programs looked similar to one another. I have nothing against lyrical programs per se, but when all competition pass with almost all of them were skating in that style, it makes the competition as a whole less interesting to watch. So more character programs, more ideas from musicals, movies, theatar, literature, religion, more 'rhytm dance' programs, more creativity and originality

 

[WeakAnkles]

Well, it still stands out, not because it is that special, but because other programs looked similiar to one another. I have nothing against lyrical programs per se, but when all competition pass with almost all of them are skating in that style, that makes the competition as a whole boring to watch. So more character programs, more ideas from musicals, movies, theatar, literatyre, religion, more 'rhytm dance' programs, more creativity and originality

Well it's been like that in Ice Dance forever. Someone has a big breakthrough with a new style and tons of teams rush to copy it. After Torvill and Dean's Bolero, Ice Dancing became like Morgue City, with everyone rushing to flop to the ice at the end of a program in torturous death throes. I guess their coaches think, hey it worked for them... And yes, it's boring. Right now, since P/C's Mozart, lyrical dances with a schemer of "modern" dance is the Flavor Du Jour. Real creativity in ID is rarely rewarded. It makes the judges uncomfortable. Look at Piper and Paul. They do a really creative dance like their Beatles/French court dance hybrid. It's very Conceptual and pushes the envelope...and goes nowhere with the judges. They take pretty much the exact same choreography, change it to an upbeat Beatles medley and voila! Best score of the season. So why be creative? It's so much easier--and often more profitable--to copy someone else's success.

 

[Baron Vladimir]

Well it's been like that in Ice Dance forever. Someone has a big breakthrough with a new style and tons of teams rush to copy it. After Torvill and Dean's Bolero, Ice Dancing became like Morgue City, with everyone rushing to flop to the ice at the end of a program in torturous death throes. I guess their coaches think, hey it worked for them... And yes, it's boring. Right now, since P/C's Mozart, lyrical dances with a schemer of "modern" dance is the Flavor Du Jour. Real creativity in ID is rarely rewarded. It makes the judges uncomfortable. Look at Piper and Paul. They do a really creative dance like their Beatles/French court dance hybrid. It's very Conceptual and pushes the envelope...and goes nowhere with the judges. They take pretty much the exact same choreography, change it to an upbeat Beatles medley and voila! Best score of the season. So why be creative? It's so much easier--and often more profitable--to copy someone else's success.

I think judges don't care that much about the programs. Skaters will be judged based on their skating, not by the program they are skating to. They wont get better or worse scores if they change to the 'current style'. And Piper and Paul are great example that indeed it is better to be unique and different (or to find its own style) cause at least general public will notice that and remember you.

 

[WeakAnkles]

I think judges don't care that much about the programs. Skaters will be judged based on their skating, not on the program they are skating to. They wont get better or worse score based on the style and changing to the current style. And Piper and Paul are great example that indeed it is better to be different and push the envelope, cause at least general public will notice that and remember you.

Oh I totally agree. I usually ask people, do you know Toller Cranston? And most hardcore skating fans will say, Yes. Because he really broke the rules and pushed the envelope and was the epitome of Different. Then I ask them, do you remember who won the Olympics the year Toller first competed in them? And they can't. 1972--Ondrej Nepala. They'll know the event, but not the skater. Because Nepala, fine skater that he was, wasn't an innovator.

 

[Baron Vladimir]

So maybe it was a good idea with introducing a bonus point for 'engaiging programs' after all. At least that could make teams to be more original/unique/themselves

 

[BillNeal]

So maybe it was a good idea with introducing a bonus point for 'engaiging programs' after all. At least that could make teams to be more original/unique/themselves

If judges don't care much about the programs as you say, how would they know what an engaging program is ? It's so subjective anyways that they could just choose to give the bonus to whoever they like. A dramatic Ave Maria program (like the one I/K did in 2012) looks quite dated but can be argued as 'engaging'. The GOE bullet already rewards creative/innovative elements at least.

 

[Baron Vladimir]

If judges don't care much about the programs as you say, how would they know what an engaging program is ? It's so subjective anyways that they could just choose to give the bonus to whoever they like. A dramatic Ave Maria program (like the one I/K did in 2012) looks quite dated but can be argued as 'engaging'. The GOE bullet already rewards creative/innovative elements at least.

You are missing my point. Its really not that important what judges think (which programs should get bonus), it would benefit the whole competitions cause teams will try more to make an engaging program! I mean, it's one thing to win/score more points with some program, and another is to make someone to like/want to watch your program.

 

[mau]

Congrats G/F for having the first good La La Land program.

Also loved S/B.

 

[BillNeal]

You are missing my point. Its really not that important what judges think (which programs should get bonus), it would benefit the whole competitions cause teams will try more to make an engaging program! I mean, it's one thing to win/score more points with some program, and another is to make someone to like/want to watch your program.

There have been many instances where competitions have been decided by less than a point. Take the past Olympic Games for example. Imagine the uproar if the Gold medal was decided by the judges giving a bonus to one team and not the other on something that is based on total subjectivity. What is defined as engaging? They would need guidelines for this bonus. But then it's a free dance, so teams should be able to choose what they want to present and not forced into certain styles to obtain this bonus.

 

[Skater Boy]

I feel like SCI was more strict as far as the tech panel, so it's hard to say how they compare perfectly. Honestly I think it's actually pretty tight between those four couples at this point.

Should we add Weapo - their score at ACI was in that range too?

 

[Skater Boy]

It honestly feels like Krylova is spending her time since she became a coach making programs for...Krylova. That program would have been a big hit...back in the early 90s.

Which is odd be cause she is late 90's

 

[IceDancingQueen]

If Papadakis and Cizeron and Virtue and Moir had a baby it would be Stepanova and Bukin.
They are my new favorites. I liked them a lot last season, now I love them.
Those seated kinda twizzles are just fab.

Haha love this [emoji23] They were my faves after V/M and P/C last year. It’s good to see them really step up a level this year - both their programmes are so good! The FD is spectacular.

 

[Baron Vladimir]

There have been many instances where competitions have been decided by less than a point. Take the past Olympic Games for example. Imagine the uproar if the Gold medal was decided by the judges giving a bonus to one team and not the other on something that is based on total subjectivity. What is defined as engaging? They would need guidelines for this bonus. But then it's a free dance, so teams should be able to choose what they want to present and not forced into certain styles to obtain this bonus.

I'm pretty sure all the top teams will get that bonus point, no matter what. I think it will just make teams trying to be more interesting. And for me its not really the most important thing who will win in the end, but if i enjoyed the ride I mean, i will always choose to watch Virtue/Moir performing their Carmen and being 2nd, than Virtue/Moir performing 'something just to makes them 1st'.

 

[Ichatdelune]

I am ashamed to admit that my eyelids betrayed me and refused to stay open after C/P. Finished catching up, thoughts:

- M/C got bronze!! Lyrical, beautiful skate, love those sharp, smooth lifts and spins. Oh, and Lorraine's dress is gorgeous. Worth mentioning twice.

- Hurtado/Khaliavin was quite enthralling. It has a soft flow filled with emotions, loved the Sign of the Times part.

- My dislike of La La Land aside, G/F have a great program. They pulled off a lovely skate here, final worthy.

- I still very much disagree with Alexandra's dress, but this program does very much suit S/B. Showcased their strong suit here, and as expected 1st place.

 

[WeakAnkles]

Which is odd be cause she is late 90's

You're right. My bad. I'm not always the best with remembering dates.

On the other hand, I always remember who I lend money to, and how much.

 

[WeakAnkles]

I'm pretty sure all the top teams will get that bonus point, no matter what. I think it will just make teams trying to be more interesting. And for me its not really the most important thing who will win in the end, but if i enjoyed the ride I mean, i will always choose to watch Virtue/Moir performing their Carmen and being 2nd, than Virtue/Moir performing 'something just to makes them 1st'.

 

[Jaana]

I´m so happy for our team Turkkila & Versluis, top 6!!! And what a beautiful programs they had.... There has been plenty of progress since I last saw them.

 

[IceDancingQueen]

I´m so happy for our team Turkkila & Versluis, top 6!!! And what a beautiful programs they had.... There has been plenty of progress since I last saw them.

They were so good. She in particular is a delight to watch. They are my happy nee surprise of the Grand Prix so far!

 

[NoNameFace]

I´m so happy for our team Turkkila & Versluis, top 6!!! And what a beautiful programs they had.... There has been plenty of progress since I last saw them.

You are a lucky nation to have such strikingly-matched and looking pair in ice dance, I saw them live at Nepela this year and along Fear/Gibson they were my discovery of the season. That FD in particular is so effortless and has purity in it.