2014 Skate Canada Free Dance 11/01

[sisinka]

So M/K are finished after this disaster? They had no justifiable reason not to podium here. RF are going to bury them and now will have no problem to prop the "swingers". They had a chance here to prove everyone wrong. S/B showed their determination and skated their lives out with one leg at the last week's SA. No excuses anymore.

Stepanova & Bukin had the advantage of having Tatiana Tarasova in Skate America personally on place, she is pushing them so much. Plus beside Chock & Bates and Shibutanis there were weak or rather couples or new unknown couples. Russian Federation is not againts this couple either. With normal Technical panel and very grateful judging in SD looking at Components which save them and kept them on the third place S&B got 143.87 points overall.

Monko & Khaliavin who had strict Technical panel who put them down even Levels which they executed and with judging panel which was neutral to them – they got overall 143.48 points.

During M&K’s SD Technical panel took one Level from both Paso Doble parts while other couples got the levels not producing better execution of those part – this was a loss of 2 points. Proper judging which other couples were awarded during FD didn’t touch Monko & Khaliavin once again. Technical panel unfairly stole another points – Level 4 executed Spin got Level 2 only – it means 2 points. Proper Level in Step Sequences which were executed on Level 3 in both, but Technical panel gave Level 2 and 1 only – they took another 4.5 points from them.

With proper Technical panel M&K would get about 8.5 points more only in Base Value of Elements. On the other hand Stepanova & Bukin skating in such atmosphere in Canada would earn about 8.5 points less then they did at Skate America (because not only Levels in not clean elements would be reduced, but also Levels from clean elements would be reduced). And if they would get about 8.5 points less, the overall mark of Stepanova & Bukin would be around 135 points, which would be a very nice 7th place in Canada. So Sasha & Ivan should thanks the God not skating in Canada, because if so, they would be close to a repetition of last season‘s Skate Canada result.

 

[Ilvskating]

Not to rain on sb's parade but I just can't warm up to Katlyn Weaver's skating. She does not move like a dancer, even with long limbs she does not have the gracefulness in movement to me. But, congratulations for a deserving win!

 

[whatif]

Stepanova & Bukin had the advantage of having Tatiana Tarasova in Skate America personally on place, she is pushing them so much. Plus beside Chock & Bates and Shibutanis there were weak or rather couples or new unknown couples. Russian Federation is not againts this couple either. With normal Technical panel and very grateful judging in SD looking at Components which save them and kept them on the third place S&B got 143.87 points overall.

Monko & Khaliavin who had strict Technical panel who put them down even Levels which they executed and with judging panel which was neutral to them – they got overall 143.48 points.

During M&K’s SD Technical panel took one Level from both Paso Doble parts while other couples got the levels not producing better execution of those part – this was a loss of 2 points. Proper judging which other couples were awarded during FD didn’t touch Monko & Khaliavin once again. Technical panel unfairly stole another points – Level 4 executed Spin got Level 2 only – it means 2 points. Proper Level in Step Sequences which were executed on Level 3 in both, but Technical panel gave Level 2 and 1 only – they took another 4.5 points from them.

With proper Technical panel M&K would get about 8.5 points more only in Base Value of Elements. On the other hand Stepanova & Bukin skating in such atmosphere in Canada would earn about 8.5 points less then they did at Skate America (because not only Levels in not clean elements would be reduced, but also Levels from clean elements would be reduced). And if they would get about 8.5 points less, the overall mark of Stepanova & Bukin would be around 135 points, which would be a very nice 7th place in Canada. So Sasha & Ivan should thanks the God not skating in Canada, because if so, they would be close to a repetition of last season‘s Skate Canada result.

What are you talking about? S/B may have had TAT in the entourage. But M/K had the tsarina Alla Shekhovtseva on the panel.

 

[elif]

Kaitlyn Weaver & Andrew Poje:

I expect the dance to become stronger during the season. I take this dance like the strongest from all dances I saw yet.

Will you do ''percentage of the close skating, number of crossovers and jumps/hops analysis'' again this year sisinka? I can't wait to read that!

 

[sisinka]

What are you talking about? S/B may have had TAT in the entourage. But M/K had the tsarina Alla Shekhovtseva on the panel.

“Tsarina“ Shekhovtsova wasn’t able to protect Monko & Khaliavin in front of Technical panel who unfairly took many points from them while other couples got Levels they deserved or higher Levels then they deserved.

And watch Technical panel at Skate Canada - Canadian Rock Lemay like a Technical specialist and an American Hal Marron like Technical controller - you shouldn’t be surprised that Levels for main rivals of H&D and G&P were once again not OK. Assistent of Technical Specialist was from Italy, so probably neutral.

Look at Skate America Technical panel – Assistent of Technical Specialists Sergei Ponomarenko – that Ponomarenko who together with Klimova trained under Tarasova who also made choreographies for them and helped them to win 1992 Olympics. That Sergei Ponomarenko in Technical panel?

I was making analysis of Skate America’s top 3 dancers, Stepanova & Bukin didn’t loose Levels unfairly, they really did mistake which leaded to lower points. No way like here.

 

[chuckm]

Yes, with that technical panel and only one favorable judge, Mme Piseev could only watch and grit her teeth at M/K's scores. There was nothing she could do.

In a way this was a reverse replay of CoR 2013 where Alla Shevhovtseva also sat as referee and where W/P and G/P were the ones getting hosed....

1 Ekaterina BOBROVA / Dmitri SOLOVIEV RUS
2 Kaitlyn WEAVER / Andrew POJE CAN
......
5 Ksenia MONKO / Kirill KHALIAVIN RUS
6 Piper GILLES / Paul POIRIER CAN

But in that instance, the tech controller was Katalin Alpern (ISR) and the tech panel Webster (GER) and Nowak-Trebacka (POL), and four of the judges were from UZB, AZE, UKR and RUS.

 

[wasabi]

Yes, with that technical panel and only one favorable judge, Mme Piseev could only watch and grit her teeth at M/K's scores. There was nothing she could do.

In a way this was a reverse replay of CoR 2013 where Alla Shevhovtseva also sat as referee and where W/P and G/P were the ones getting hosed....

1 Ekaterina BOBROVA / Dmitri SOLOVIEV RUS
2 Kaitlyn WEAVER / Andrew POJE CAN
......
5 Ksenia MONKO / Kirill KHALIAVIN RUS
6 Piper GILLES / Paul POIRIER CAN

But in that instance, the tech controller was Katalin Alpern (ISR) and the tech panel Webster (GER) and Nowak-Trebacka (POL), and four of the judges were from UZB, AZE, UKR and RUS.

K/W should absolutely have been ahead of B/S. G/P definitley not hosed - just not gifted as they so often are.

 

[WeakAnkles]

Dear GOD I miss Ziggy.

 

[rain]

Kaitlyn Weaver & Andrew Poje:


But to give an opinion to people that they saw something special which took their breath away... it needs to put all soul into it and live throught the program. And it didn’t happen this time. There was not a magic this time in the dance (the magic I saw in their last season’s Tango).

I feel rather sorry for you that you didn't see the magic in this — at least not yet. I certainly did.

 

[flutzy13]

After seeing Hubbell and Donahue, i can see Hawayek and Baker placing better than them at US Nationals this year.

Agree I see them dangerously close to falling into Lynn and Logan territory- fan favorites but perennially on the outside looking in. They haven't been higher than fourth or on a world team since 2012. It will be very easy for the judges/federation to decide to keep them there and push the Jr World champs with star quality.

 

[SHA]

That’s an interesting scenario and makes since going with younger teams . Who did H&B compete against when they won Junior World’s and how have they finished when competing against any of the other US teams. I thought H&B competed together in Omaha and in Boston

 

[Mrs. P]

That’s an interesting scenario and makes since going with younger teams . Who did H&B compete against when they won Junior World’s and how have they finished when competing against any of the other US teams. I thought H&B competed together in Omaha and in Boston

Hawayek and Baker have competed in juniors the last two years so they haven't competed against the top senior teams. Most of the teams the beat at junior worlds are still in juniors actually...

They had a nice debut at Nebelhorn.

 

[flutzy13]

Hawayek and Baker have competed in juniors the last two years so they haven't competed against the top senior teams. Most of the teams the beat at junior worlds are still in juniors actually...

They had a nice debut at Nebelhorn.

Right but I'm not sure its a question of whether they can compete with the top teams internationally this season. I don't think anyone expects that. They got a tough draw with the Cup of Russia field but I think they have an equal shot at medaling at NHK as H/D do at Bompard. Anyway, it's a question of whether they can win a bronze at US Nationals. If they have a decent fall debut, I think the federation may want to get them on the world stage so that in 2 years, they will be competing with top senior teams. They'll have to skate well at Nationals but they have the talent and the programs where a 3rd place is in no way out of the question.

 

[katia]

Dear GOD I miss Ziggy.

me too

 

[katia]

“Tsarina“ Shekhovtsova wasn’t able to protect Monko & Khaliavin in front of Technical panel who unfairly took many points from them while other couples got Levels they deserved or higher Levels then they deserved.

And watch Technical panel at Skate Canada - Canadian Rock Lemay like a Technical specialist and an American Hal Marron like Technical controller - you shouldn’t be surprised that Levels for main rivals of H&D and G&P were once again not OK. Assistent of Technical Specialist was from Italy, so probably neutral.

Poor, poor Russian pairs. It is always a fault of bad (read: Western)technical panel when they are loosing. On ther other hand, when they are winning and a technical controller/specialist is a Russian this is their own talent which shines through, NOT at all connected with russian technical controller.

 

[sisinka]

Poor, poor Russian pairs. It is always a fault of bad (read: Western)technical panel when they are loosing. On ther other hand, when they are winning and a technical controller/specialist is a Russian this is their own talent which shines through, NOT at all connected with russian technical controller.

Why so?

I can’t speak about all competitions in last 50 years of Ice Dance. This season I made analysis of one Junior and two Seniors Grand Prix and my analysis is described somewhere here.

During those three events I found mistakes in Technical panel‘s decision and I wrote about it.
During those three events I wrote about, it happened twice in Zagreb and Kelowna that Russian Dance Team or Teams got lower Levels than they should get.
During those events it happened that couples from another country than Russia got higher levels and marks than deserved – USA, Canada, Ukraine, Hungary.

I understand that my analysis are too long to be read by everybody, but if you put some more effort to read it, you would notice that there were also “poor“ Spanish couple and “poor“ American couple who should get higher Components then they got.

And speaking concretely about senior Grand Prix, I didn’t think and I never wrote that Russian Dance Team should win here in Canada or in America.

Judging if not correct is wrong in any case no matter what country the couple or judges/Technical specialists are from. It is not my fault that Russian couples were those who were underscored here….and it is not my fault that it was US/Canadian/Italian Technical panel which gave them unfairly low score.

I would like to see clear judging. Any problem with it?

 

[sisinka]

Poor, poor Russian pairs. It is always a fault of bad (read: Western)technical panel when they are loosing. On ther other hand, when they are winning and a technical controller/specialist is a Russian this is their own talent which shines through, NOT at all connected with russian technical controller.

In figure skating terminology "Pairs" are used for Pair Cathegory - those with real big jumps and lifts above head.

 

[katia]

Why so?

would like to see clear judging. Any problem with it?

Of course, but I think judging was clear I mean no stumble in step sequence, no cutting in levels?

 

[WeakAnkles]

What Katia said.

And then some (but I'm being EXCESSIVELY polite here).

 

[katia]

In figure skating terminology "Pairs" are used for Pair Cathegory - those with real big jumps and lifts above head.

Well, next time I will write "dance pairs", or perhaps a "dance team", would that be OK with you, O Picky One?