2017 CS Finlandia Free Dance

[msaidi]

Sorry but based on ONE B level competition I can't say that at all. I mean not AT ALL.

Voir has ALWAYS ALWAYS been a late season team. One might even call them a second half season team. They tinker and tinker and tinker until then. Just their MO.

I agree that V&M are a late season team but for me PC are even more late seaon than the canadian haha ( since 2014/2015 they always struggle (lost GPF 2014 , lots of mistakes,in EU) in early/mid season and impress everyone late season

 

[Snow63]

Is anyone else annoyed how Gabriella's skirt moves during the skate because of the split? Sometimes it goes between her legs and doesn't look good :noshake:

Yes! I was about to post that. Annoying as hell.

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

I actually like that rule When there's a fall or a big mistake, I don't want to see 10s.

Because 9.75 is so much better?!

Good lord. There was a fall. In ice dance. 9.50+ is absolutely ridiculous, no matter what team it is. At this point why even have the judges there if they're going to give 57.91/60 for a performance with a major error on an element.

Finlandia wasn't getting too crazy in the overscoring-top-skaters department but this FD just sealed them in the same category as Lombardia and ACI. Shame on the judges.

Besides that however, I for one really like P/C's Moonlight Sonata and think it's better than the vast majority of MS performances previously done.

 

[ancientpeas]

I don't think we will know which team the judges prefer until they go head to head (presumably at the GPF but.. ice is slippery). The scores are always sort of irrelevant until they are head to head.

I find I'm way more torn this year than last year with which I prefer, V/M or P/C. Last year I liked both Free Dances but really liked V/M's SD so that made the difference for me. This year I'm pretty sure I'm going to end up liking P/C's Free more than V/M (and this from someone who actually likes Roxanne..but Moonlight Sonata is my favourite piece of classical music ever..and I always think of G/G which takes me to my happy place). I thought P/C SD looked slow but I think once they get the speed up they won't be far behind V/M's SD. In the end I hope the best team wins. And I'm okay with it working out like this: V/M help us get the team gold and P/C get the Ice dance gold. That way both teams win a gold medal. See..it all works out. I'm not counting out the Russians though. Now that they seem to have Kolyada firing on all cylinders I'd say they are the favourite for team gold.

Kind of surprised by some of the results. Why are my beloved dirty dancing Poles in 10th?

S/B jumped over the Danes here. They were behind them last year.

Really looking forward to the GP season started. Garden belly goes up this week!

 

[NoNameFace]

I have to completely disagree here. V/M said it themselves after their free at Autumn classic it wasn't really the outcome they wanted. The elements were there BUT the performance wasn't as strong as they hoped to be (which was my impression too). They'll make some changes and I'm sure it will improve.
I prefer P/C's FD (and style/skating for that matter) more than V/M but come on, NOBODY who enjoys Ice dance just a tiny bit would hope that what V/M showed at Autumn classic what the best they could offer. And they usually skate extremely well when there is big competition against them (which means P/C for them).

For some reason people are really into this idea that P/C are going into the Olympics with an edge over the competition. I don't buy it. Last season they also got huge scores when they were on their own but fell behind V/M as soon as they went head to head. Who knows if Tessa and Scott would have been 2nd in the FS at worlds if the other half of the panel had also ignored the stumble. I am rooting for P/C but they are the underdogs and not the front-runners this time around.

Sorry but based on ONE B level competition I can't say that at all. I mean not AT ALL.

Voir has ALWAYS ALWAYS been a late season team. One might even call them a second half season team. They tinker and tinker and tinker until then. Just their MO.

Having actually both teams after their Senior B competitions done where they premiered their programs officially, I think that they are both 'front-runners'. Those programs, directions, approaches they went for this season - in both SD and FD - shows how different both teams are and how 'personally customized' those programs are, which is a great thing for me. With FD especially, I see that those choices were made not only 'for the impact/effect' in terms of competition, but also (or moreover) to reflect themselves, their sensibility, what moves them, what they want to say through this music chosen. While it is a good thing, it is also a challenging one - for both of them; I'm looking forward to see how those FDs in particular will develop, how the dynamics will work to balance between personal wish/desire and final effect, how it all will translate into movement.

Both teams are playing on their strenghts and aesthetics, with more 'personal' ingredient than ever I think - it is a good thing for both of them doing Senior B competitions to see for themselves how the final effect looks for now and what is the desire, plan for it to look, feel like. It will be interesting to see what 'tools' both teams will use, how much their programs will change choreographically/movement-wise and how they will change reception-wise.

To state that Gabriella and Guillaume are ones to bet on, the ones to be chased right now, after first showing, is for me like doing a favour to Tessa and Scott - I think they would like to be underdogs, those 'underestimated ones' due to material comparison with French team, they would only benefit from that, working on their own stuff, building it on their own like they did last year where lots of people could not believe that they stand even a mere chance in competition with Gabriella and Guillaume. Yes - based on the material, musical choices, even on those scores received/performances at competitions we can put our bets: what we personally like and what we think judges will prefer, but only next competitions will tell what the tendencies will be.

 

[nimi]

S/B jumped over the Danes here. They were behind them last year.

Step/Buk? Didn't they win last year here (over Hub/Don)?

 

[LaArdilla]

Because 9.75 is so much better?!

Good lord. There was a fall. In ice dance. 9.50+ is absolutely ridiculous, no matter what team it is. At this point why even have the judges there if they're going to give 57.91/60 for a performance with a major error on an element.

Finlandia wasn't getting too crazy in the overscoring-top-skaters department but this FD just sealed them in the same category as Lombardia and ACI. Shame on the judges.

Besides that however, I for one really like P/C's Moonlight Sonata and think it's better than the vast majority of MS performances previously done.

Have you seen the scores Caro got for her short here? With a fall AND no combo? It was a crazy event.

 

[Bcash]

I have to completely disagree here. V/M said it themselves after their free at Autumn classic it wasn't really the outcome they wanted. The elements were there BUT the performance wasn't as strong as they hoped to be (which was my impression too). They'll make some changes and I'm sure it will improve.
I prefer P/C's FD (and style/skating for that matter) more than V/M but come on, NOBODY who enjoys Ice dance just a tiny bit would hope that what V/M showed at Autumn classic what the best they could offer. And they usually skate extremely well when there is big competition against them (which means P/C for them).

I don't know if they said that because they did not get the score they wanted. To me you can only milk so much out of that overused music and cliched storyline, which they did with an intensity bordering on overkill. Tessa was in absolute top form as always since their return. That said, I'm not enthusiastic about P/C's music either, mainly because I'm not a Piano Sonata kind of classical music fan, and much prefer strings (which is why I like their 2015-16 FD the best). But this piece of music does offer more room for interpretation, which they can continue to explore.

 

[Anyasnake]

Because 9.75 is so much better?!

Good lord. There was a fall. In ice dance. 9.50+ is absolutely ridiculous, no matter what team it is. At this point why even have the judges there if they're going to give 57.91/60 for a performance with a major error on an element.

Finlandia wasn't getting too crazy in the overscoring-top-skaters department but this FD just sealed them in the same category as Lombardia and ACI. Shame on the judges.

Besides that however, I for one really like P/C's Moonlight Sonata and think it's better than the vast majority of MS performances previously done.

Yes, it's better than a bunchloads of 10s I think. And when judges are drown to the performance, they can really give out the 10s. I believe that they skated really well minus the fall and that a biased judge could go all the way. Turns out they got the lowest PCS (9.25) from the french judge. I actually prefer that. But it can make a difference : ask Nathalie Pechalat, because Worlds 2014 were all about these differences.
But like every other competition : let's wait for the GPs to see if the scoring holds up. I think they were awesome and actually deserve what they got.

 

[sk8dc]

How did you guys come up with the acronym "gadbois" for hagenouer dubreil etc? I tried to figure it out, but I am stumped. Help please!

 

[Anyasnake]

I don't know if they said that because they did not get the score they wanted. To me you can only milk so much out of that overused music and cliched storyline, which they did with an intensity bordering on overkill. Tessa was in absolute top form as always since their return. That said, I'm not enthusiastic about P/C's music either, mainly because I'm not a Piano Sonata kind of classical music fan, and much prefer strings (which is why I like their 2015-16 FD the best). But this piece of music does offer more room for interpretation, which they can continue to explore.

Hum, if I found out their performance to be less than what we are used to from them, their coaches will also. I'm waiting for the next competition to see where exactly it will change. If they wanted to do Moulin Rouge so bad, they'll end up using the music to the best of their abilities I believe.

 

[Bcash]

Sorry but based on ONE B level competition I can't say that at all. I mean not AT ALL.

Voir has ALWAYS ALWAYS been a late season team. One might even call them a second half season team. They tinker and tinker and tinker until then. Just their MO.

As if other teams don't tinker.. I see no reason to portray them as a late season team because if you look at their career, most of the late season rise was purely because she was injured someway or another and could not skate much before Worlds. And their programs last season came out polished and stayed that way. The judges just lavished high scores on them because of their names.

 

[chameleon]

How did you guys come up with the acronym "gadbois" for hagenouer dubreil etc? I tried to figure it out, but I am stumped. Help please!

It's not an acronym, its the name of the rink they coach at. You'll often see people use rink names as shorthands, especially if there are a number of coaches working at the rink. Canton for Marina, Novi for Igor, etc.

 

[Mango]

As if other teams don't tinker.. I see no reason to portray them as a late season team because if you look at their career, most of the late season rise was purely because she was injured someway or another and could not skate much before Worlds. And their programs last season came out polished and stayed that way. The judges just lavished high scores on them because of their names.

You know we could say this about some other teams too. But you know, Tessa & Scott actually did perform at a high level and tried their best to get their levels. They even changed a lift which helped them secure victories at NHK and GPF.

By the way according to xeyra's research that "overused music and cliched storyline" of Moulin Rouge is the most commonly used warhorse this season. Do you dismiss them all?

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

Have you seen the scores Caro got for her short here? With a fall AND no combo? It was a crazy event.

Oh yeah. Her free too. Absolutely ridiculous.

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

OMG, i didnt even register the fall

Apparently the judges didn't either. :sarcasm:

 

[rain]

I agree that V&M are a late season team but for me PC are even more late seaon than the canadian haha ( since 2014/2015 they always struggle (lost GPF 2014 , lots of mistakes,in EU) in early/mid season and impress everyone late season

I agree that these are both teams that tend to peak late-season. They don't usually look underprepared early season (which neither does now), but they are working with such difficult material that there's room to grow. This is not a bad thing.

Anyhow, this was my first chance to see P/C's new FD, and like V/M's FD I'm not immediately blown away like I was last season. It's got some great stuff in it — I really like the beginning and several of the lifts, but it's not as avant garde as I would have preferred, which seemed to be the direction they were headed last year. At times it's just "pretty" in the traditional ice dance sense, rather than memorable. Personally, I'm hoping both P/C's and V/M's free dances evolve significantly from this point. I don't think either has hit it choreographically out of the park yet.

As for the short dances - V/Ms is way ahead, IMO. P/C don't seem as fundamentally incapable of finding the mood of the latin as they were last year in the blues, Gabriella, in particular is selling it hard. But I found her over the top rather than authentic (I know, I know, latin ballroom, but still) and the choreography for her arms is way too busy and distracting. The last section was probably the best. Awkward music transition into it though. It baffles me that they seem to have almost no chemistry in this. It's not like they don't create chemistry between the two them in their free dances. Their short dances really are their weakness and I see nothing here to change that.

 

[sk8dc]

It's not an acronym, its the name of the rink they coach at. You'll often see people use rink names as shorthands, especially if there are a number of coaches working at the rink. Canton for Marina, Novi for Igor, etc.

Chameleon: Thank you for clearing this up!

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

Yes, it's better than a bunchloads of 10s I think. And when judges are drown to the performance, they can really give out the 10s. I believe that they skated really well minus the fall and that a biased judge could go all the way. Turns out they got the lowest PCS (9.25) from the french judge. I actually prefer that. But it can make a difference : ask Nathalie Pechalat, because Worlds 2014 were all about these differences.
But like every other competition : let's wait for the GPs to see if the scoring holds up. I think they were awesome and actually deserve what they got.

Sorry but a 9.75 is barely acknowledging the error. It is essentially a perfect score.

In ice dance especially, fall should score no more than 9.0 in PE. Certainly it affects interpretation. And should affect choreography as it is a break in it.

For a judge to say "well I acknowledged that major error by taking 0.25 off." is like a judge giving +2 for a jump with a mediocre landing and justifying it as saying "well I didn't give it a +3!"

 

[ancientpeas]

Step/Buk? Didn't they win last year here (over Hub/Don)?

I'm not sure about that but I do know they were behind them at worlds.