Stepanova/Bukin didn't get one key point correctly? Wow. I need to rewatch that
Protocols: http://www.figureskatingresults.fi/results/1718/CSFIN2017/CSFIN2017_IceDance_SD_Scores.pdf
One? I think they didn't get three lol
))
2017 CS Finlandia Short Dance
- Thread starter dorispulaski
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One? I think they didn't get three lol
))
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This channel has all of them
https://www.youtube.com/user/AOLManager/videos?disable_polymer=1
and, Brau Avita has them all on youtube here, except last 2 teams which I believe will be up soon.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCM_UaC4Afd9QAAXQowpJcrQ
So does this channel have 4 or 5 vids
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCrp9nRMPJe6o5WEV-6F03Ng/videos?disable_polymer=1
Last edited:
The first two key points are two choctaws by each partner, and the third one is the last cross forward and first 4 steps of the second section (change of edge on step 3, and clean edges on every other step) by both partners.
One? I think they didn't get three lol
Well, they didn't get [even] one, that's what I said
Thank you ! It's actually trickier to get all the Key points for this pattern...
Well, yes. They included several steps in each KP. Although the steps are not that difficult
Ok, I'm quite new in the figure skating world and, for sure, I don't fully understand the scoring system yet. But can you give me your opinions about McNamara&Carpenter's sd? They were the first ice dancers I saw on youtube a few months ago and I actually started to enjoy ice dance because of them. So since then I really support them and hope that they'll stand on the podium in the future. I watched them at the Lake Placid International and ACI. They got really good scores at the first event, now it seems a bit overscored to me but I still think their skating was great. After watching ACI, I was a little bit dissapointed, because their score was a bit lower than at the LPI, but still, it was good. And today I got the impression that it was their best skate of the three they had so far and they didn't get even 60 points. I know it depends on the judges and I probably don't see many things, but I want to know, what do you think about this performance. Do you agree with the score? Sorry if I made any mistake, English is not my first language
I think they skated better too, I can´t open the protocols. Anyway, I am glad it seems that the top 3 american teams have their olympic spot sure (I hope don´t jinx them :shock2
Someone did. :giveup:
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Several teams did :hopelessness:
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Watch their feet and you will see why they didn't score higher. Lots of 2 foot skating and snow where the toe rake catches particularly on Betina
I also felt they skated slower today than normal.
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This was not a good performance but the program has potential. I thought they were better even at test skate. Popova is quite the performer but there’s room for improvement on the technical side.
: I think, it is appropriate for (Brazilian) Samba. The music and costume clashed
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Yep, I felt they were stronger at the test skates too, where they really impressed me.
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- Nov 12, 2012
okay, had some time to re-watch some of SDs, but then had to go out with my dog I babysit this week for a walk, just carved some time now to post thoughts...
the general issue I have with lots of dances I re-watched is simple lack of cohesion/flow between music, movement, costume, expression, and this may be generated from pure lack of strong idea/concept for that Latin-themed SD this season. With some of teams it is visible that they wanted to get some bits from 'Latin ballroom' convention and mix them with 'Latin modern' elements and then their expression/interpretation fell somewhere in between, which caused confusion, dissonant feeling in me. For me, it takes quite a skilled hand of choreographer/coach and a right team to juggle/balance those notions of having let's say 'authentic Latin' referrence in their program, but with modern outlook/take, the entire different story is to perform/express this kind of program/concept successfully, which for me means in believable, confident and effortless way. But there were also some good, strong concepts of this 'Latin' SD put out there - no neccessarily that I liked them all personally, but I do not see a point of condemning the program altogether only because it does not suit my taste; if the particular team sells it, feels confident and they enjoy themselves while performing it - it's perfectly fine, enthusiasm, attack and strong performance always attract their audience.
Carolane and Shane - this is the first example of Latin clash for me: the music, choreo, vibe, movement seem to be designed for flirtacious, subtly sensual effect while costuming - particularly from Carolane's side - feels anything but. Shane actually looks fine for me - the casual t-shirt adds that 'street', nonchalant vibe to the wole look and I see it going well with music, but Carolane...Her look not only clashes with Shae's, but with the whole dance: she looks just too heavy, too overdone, the dress feels more 'Latin ballroom tournament' than sexy street dance vibe,the make-up adds to the heaviness of her whole look, too. And the dress is BLACK - yes, it has some metalics, but the overall effect is more of Cleopatra than Latina. Some will definitely wonder why I waste so much time for complaining about things like costuming - the point for me is that the dance poses some complex visual/optic, where the entourage is equally important for the final effect like actual movement; each program is a compex wholesome of different elements and it really affects my reception/reaction when I see some clash between then, even being costumes. Besides - I do think that with Latin-themed SD costuming/attire is quite important to 'back up' the dance, the idea, the right costume could really sell the dance, make it more impactful, sell the concept, present movement in more attractive way, hence me paying so much attention to this thing (apologies in advance for those annoyed). Being back to Carolane/Shane, I really, really wish for 'lighter' attire for her to match the playfulness of the dance, their connection, some of choreography looked very nice and not obvious, e.g. lift placement in-between rhythm change and the way that lift fitted the music change.
Another confusion were - unfortunately - Natalia and Maksim. WHAT THE HECK IS WITH THESE FUNERAL, BALLROOM TOURNAMENT-LIKE COSTUMES?! Guys, you have 'Despacito', Shakira, some salsa beat and you are dressed with no feel, no reflection of that music...The fact that there was so much of being covered up in black really affected my reception of the whole dance - I do believe that the choreo, the design have some spark to be ignited by their performers' attitude and great conncetion with themselves and the audience, but today it somehow felt flat and uninspiring for me. Again - the whole outlook needs to be re-thought, they should make it less 'formal' and proper in terms of movement, costume; the partnering needs to be more defined and continous between them, of course technical elements need polishing, but the dance as a whole just needs some breathing, space to make it enjoyable more, both for them and for the audience. And it needs more colour, flavour, texture in it, even by those darn costumes. At this point there is too much of confusion for me - costumes felt funerally-proper&prime, music felt young, vibrant, cheeky, movement/choreo felt kind of stiff/restained, expression/selling were probably the only thing on point...
Sara/Kiril - biggest props for the music chosen, the mix between 'Oye como va' and 'Maria' gave that Latino moderne' feel; for me it has enough 'authentic Latin' feel without being too obvious about it. Looking at Sara, it really resonates this Latin attitude, musicality, how to express/interpret the rhythm in effortless, natural way, the pity is that Kiril feels more forced and that the choreography is either 'work in progress' or is that 'choppy' in places. I think thst the program overall needs to be spiced up by something: movement, gestures, expression, costuming, for now it feels kind of forgettable and it pains me, becuase I love Sara to death and wish that partnership anything but the very best. More committment from Kiril, colour splash in Sara's costume, more 'suave' in expression could give the kick. On a better note, I love Sara's hands' work, how she finishes movement, I also like the cut/the idea of her costume - just wishing the upper part would be e.g. in red.
Laurence/Nikolai - I will repeat myself, but this is one of the strongest SDs conceptually/idea-wise this season: from music cuts, through movement/attitude presented to costumes. This is the effect I deside, regardless of aesthetic preferred - an absolute cohesion between all elements building the dance, committment in selling it, making it look believable with easiness, confidence aura about it. Moreover - with each outing, the program feels even stronger and they seem to more play with this convention than only put it out on ice as a dance. Saying it all, it is not only an effective display of cohesive concept, BUT a cohesive concept matching the team's aesthetic, way of movement, expression. This 'Latino vintage country club' vibe of the whole dance suits their elegant, polished style very much, it's very smart from coaching team to play on team's strenghts than making them shrink into some abstract idea of 'Latin perfection', which does not exist at all or vary between teams. Of course it does not disturb that they are both naturally 'suave' and are together off-ice, it really amps the connection, in the way he's partnering, how the expression looks like. And I will repeat myself again, but I just cannot get over the fact that they won't get a chance to present such strong dance at Olympics - the way they developed their own style, ow they've progressed in terms of technique, performance quality is huge. It's just such shame...
Alexandra/Ivan - I know I'm annoying with this costume thing, but for me, Alexandra's dress should be an example how to make a beautifl dress that is extremely flattering for the lady wearing it AND for the character of the dance. Kudos for the designer, because the dress is simply stunning, it moves beautifully, the frnge on the lower part with slight shine in it perfectly accentuates Alexandra's killer legs, open back adds sexiness, appliques look sophisticated. Ivan with classical black, but with some cleavage lloks great and complimentary to Alexandra's look. As for the dance, I could whine for this and that (which I'll do next
), but I actually dig that SD, because they feel comfortable and confident in that convention, they really got the crowd going which is a sign of a good vehicle, Sia or not Sia. I actually think that in terms of music, this is quite a good attempt of mashing something 'Latin-Latin' with something 'so-so-Latin', there is certain amount of flow (maybe except of pattern, but will get there...) and cohesion in that dance, feels young, vibrant, playful - like it should be for team like them. I really like their attack and connection between them, Ivan is really good, as for Alexandra - I would live without some of 'fish-out-of-water' like expression at places, especially when there's a pose/stop to accentuate music, sole movement is enough. I like very much that her flexibility is used, exposed in the dance - when you have it, flaunt it, and I actually think that all 'flexible' transitions/movements are done quite tastefully and in moderated amount. However, that pattern...I have no knowledge about key points, but even I saw that this patter was executed very poorly from them. The basic difficulty in it lays for me in the fact that it is side-by-side pattern, not being in hold/staying opposite to themselves - this pattern requires just similar expertise/level of technique, knee bend between two partners to look good for the eye, with Stepanova/Bukin it was painfully obvious that she has not the same level of technique executing it as Bukin has: she was way higher with centre/knees than him, the edge work was not that prminent and sure as Bukin's, they looked just so different and disconnected during that part...It is a pity, because the rest of the dance was really good and they sold it very confidently; it's a great vehicle for them, playing on their strenghts, youthful look, connection and chemistry, but they should really work on that pattern - score they got should be enough motivation, because judges seemed to like this dance quite much. And for me the design of the dance was really well mtched by the way it was performed which is always a good thing to see.
And Gabriella and Guillaume...I have to say that honestly this is not what I expected, so I will just need time to adjust and get used to this outlook of things. To be clear - my general impression is positive, there are just couple of things that bothers me and disturbs that positivity...First thing – I do think that the music they used and the choreography are chosen/made to highlight their view on this Latin theme for SD this year, not other way around; I do get that for some it is carricature of Latin and Sheeran's music is misplaced there, but with this team and the choreographer they got to work with for SD I see the direction from where they are going. Since their breakthrough season 2014/15, their Short Dances were more of a play onto rhythms, variation on the theme posed than submitting strictly to the rules and falling into 'desired' or 'predictable' convetion for the particular theme – and this SD is no exception; the music is definitely a debatable choice (so is music for many other teams), but if they are feeling good with it, then it is all what matters. I think that the best thing is how well the choreography reflects on their way of movement, it seems to accommodate it instead of bending it into some standard. This is very 'their' interpretation, reflection of Latin-themed SD, focusing more on play with rhythm in more modern aesthetic with strong pointing on doing it in their style. From this first outing I feel that they are enjoying this dance quite much, there is confidence and committment about it. Saying that, my biggest issue is about music cuts – not the music used, pieces themselves, but how they were cut and mixed together. The lack of flow in transitions between 3 parts kind of kills for me the flow they achieve through their movement; honestly, I expected more of just 2-piece dance, starting with 'Thinking out loud', getting into 'Shape of you', not mixing it up between. It is just my personal feeling of 'accientality' of those cuts between pieces, whereas movement, choreo seems to be so well-thought, maybe I'll get used to it the more I'll watch the dance. The second thing at bothers me a bit is the lift – again, it is not about the lift itself, just my feeling that it does not fit for that program or for that particular part of the dance. I think it's too busy and too rushed just after rhythm change/music cut, I wonder how a rotational one would look like in that place, again, just my impression looking at the dance overall. About Gabriella's costume – I kind of get the effect for they were going as for having Latin referrences on their own terms and in their own range, the costume could be a part of that, along with some dance/choreo moves incorporated. The dress is a fabulous one and Gabriella is looking great, however I do feel that the 'Latin-Latin' referrence is too strong there, addressing it to the modernity of musical choice, the way choreography is designed to highlight their personal style, way of movement on first place and how Latin-simplistic (yet effective and in sync with the music chosen) Guillaume costume is. Again, this is just my personal impression and I think that the subtle Latin referrences in movement/poses/figures here and there are enough to get that balance between program effectiveness and the feel of being custom-designed for them, I am curious how Gabriella would look like in a dress/costume similar to her Waltz SD red dress, but made as two-piece (top and short, but flowy skirt) in one, vibrant colour.
the general issue I have with lots of dances I re-watched is simple lack of cohesion/flow between music, movement, costume, expression, and this may be generated from pure lack of strong idea/concept for that Latin-themed SD this season. With some of teams it is visible that they wanted to get some bits from 'Latin ballroom' convention and mix them with 'Latin modern' elements and then their expression/interpretation fell somewhere in between, which caused confusion, dissonant feeling in me. For me, it takes quite a skilled hand of choreographer/coach and a right team to juggle/balance those notions of having let's say 'authentic Latin' referrence in their program, but with modern outlook/take, the entire different story is to perform/express this kind of program/concept successfully, which for me means in believable, confident and effortless way. But there were also some good, strong concepts of this 'Latin' SD put out there - no neccessarily that I liked them all personally, but I do not see a point of condemning the program altogether only because it does not suit my taste; if the particular team sells it, feels confident and they enjoy themselves while performing it - it's perfectly fine, enthusiasm, attack and strong performance always attract their audience.
Carolane and Shane - this is the first example of Latin clash for me: the music, choreo, vibe, movement seem to be designed for flirtacious, subtly sensual effect while costuming - particularly from Carolane's side - feels anything but. Shane actually looks fine for me - the casual t-shirt adds that 'street', nonchalant vibe to the wole look and I see it going well with music, but Carolane...Her look not only clashes with Shae's, but with the whole dance: she looks just too heavy, too overdone, the dress feels more 'Latin ballroom tournament' than sexy street dance vibe,the make-up adds to the heaviness of her whole look, too. And the dress is BLACK - yes, it has some metalics, but the overall effect is more of Cleopatra than Latina. Some will definitely wonder why I waste so much time for complaining about things like costuming - the point for me is that the dance poses some complex visual/optic, where the entourage is equally important for the final effect like actual movement; each program is a compex wholesome of different elements and it really affects my reception/reaction when I see some clash between then, even being costumes. Besides - I do think that with Latin-themed SD costuming/attire is quite important to 'back up' the dance, the idea, the right costume could really sell the dance, make it more impactful, sell the concept, present movement in more attractive way, hence me paying so much attention to this thing (apologies in advance for those annoyed
). Being back to Carolane/Shane, I really, really wish for 'lighter' attire for her to match the playfulness of the dance, their connection, some of choreography looked very nice and not obvious, e.g. lift placement in-between rhythm change and the way that lift fitted the music change.Another confusion were - unfortunately - Natalia and Maksim. WHAT THE HECK IS WITH THESE FUNERAL, BALLROOM TOURNAMENT-LIKE COSTUMES?! Guys, you have 'Despacito', Shakira, some salsa beat and you are dressed with no feel, no reflection of that music...The fact that there was so much of being covered up in black really affected my reception of the whole dance - I do believe that the choreo, the design have some spark to be ignited by their performers' attitude and great conncetion with themselves and the audience, but today it somehow felt flat and uninspiring for me. Again - the whole outlook needs to be re-thought, they should make it less 'formal' and proper in terms of movement, costume; the partnering needs to be more defined and continous between them, of course technical elements need polishing, but the dance as a whole just needs some breathing, space to make it enjoyable more, both for them and for the audience. And it needs more colour, flavour, texture in it, even by those darn costumes. At this point there is too much of confusion for me - costumes felt funerally-proper&prime, music felt young, vibrant, cheeky, movement/choreo felt kind of stiff/restained, expression/selling were probably the only thing on point...
Sara/Kiril - biggest props for the music chosen, the mix between 'Oye como va' and 'Maria' gave that Latino moderne' feel; for me it has enough 'authentic Latin' feel without being too obvious about it. Looking at Sara, it really resonates this Latin attitude, musicality, how to express/interpret the rhythm in effortless, natural way, the pity is that Kiril feels more forced and that the choreography is either 'work in progress' or is that 'choppy' in places. I think thst the program overall needs to be spiced up by something: movement, gestures, expression, costuming, for now it feels kind of forgettable and it pains me, becuase I love Sara to death and wish that partnership anything but the very best. More committment from Kiril, colour splash in Sara's costume, more 'suave' in expression could give the kick. On a better note, I love Sara's hands' work, how she finishes movement, I also like the cut/the idea of her costume - just wishing the upper part would be e.g. in red.
Laurence/Nikolai - I will repeat myself, but this is one of the strongest SDs conceptually/idea-wise this season: from music cuts, through movement/attitude presented to costumes. This is the effect I deside, regardless of aesthetic preferred - an absolute cohesion between all elements building the dance, committment in selling it, making it look believable with easiness, confidence aura about it. Moreover - with each outing, the program feels even stronger and they seem to more play with this convention than only put it out on ice as a dance. Saying it all, it is not only an effective display of cohesive concept, BUT a cohesive concept matching the team's aesthetic, way of movement, expression. This 'Latino vintage country club' vibe of the whole dance suits their elegant, polished style very much, it's very smart from coaching team to play on team's strenghts than making them shrink into some abstract idea of 'Latin perfection', which does not exist at all or vary between teams. Of course it does not disturb that they are both naturally 'suave' and are together off-ice, it really amps the connection, in the way he's partnering, how the expression looks like. And I will repeat myself again, but I just cannot get over the fact that they won't get a chance to present such strong dance at Olympics - the way they developed their own style, ow they've progressed in terms of technique, performance quality is huge. It's just such shame...
Alexandra/Ivan - I know I'm annoying with this costume thing, but for me, Alexandra's dress should be an example how to make a beautifl dress that is extremely flattering for the lady wearing it AND for the character of the dance. Kudos for the designer, because the dress is simply stunning, it moves beautifully, the frnge on the lower part with slight shine in it perfectly accentuates Alexandra's killer legs, open back adds sexiness, appliques look sophisticated. Ivan with classical black, but with some cleavage lloks great and complimentary to Alexandra's look. As for the dance, I could whine for this and that (which I'll do next
), but I actually dig that SD, because they feel comfortable and confident in that convention, they really got the crowd going which is a sign of a good vehicle, Sia or not Sia. I actually think that in terms of music, this is quite a good attempt of mashing something 'Latin-Latin' with something 'so-so-Latin', there is certain amount of flow (maybe except of pattern, but will get there...) and cohesion in that dance, feels young, vibrant, playful - like it should be for team like them. I really like their attack and connection between them, Ivan is really good, as for Alexandra - I would live without some of 'fish-out-of-water' like expression at places, especially when there's a pose/stop to accentuate music, sole movement is enough. I like very much that her flexibility is used, exposed in the dance - when you have it, flaunt it, and I actually think that all 'flexible' transitions/movements are done quite tastefully and in moderated amount. However, that pattern...I have no knowledge about key points, but even I saw that this patter was executed very poorly from them. The basic difficulty in it lays for me in the fact that it is side-by-side pattern, not being in hold/staying opposite to themselves - this pattern requires just similar expertise/level of technique, knee bend between two partners to look good for the eye, with Stepanova/Bukin it was painfully obvious that she has not the same level of technique executing it as Bukin has: she was way higher with centre/knees than him, the edge work was not that prminent and sure as Bukin's, they looked just so different and disconnected during that part...It is a pity, because the rest of the dance was really good and they sold it very confidently; it's a great vehicle for them, playing on their strenghts, youthful look, connection and chemistry, but they should really work on that pattern - score they got should be enough motivation, because judges seemed to like this dance quite much. And for me the design of the dance was really well mtched by the way it was performed which is always a good thing to see.And Gabriella and Guillaume...I have to say that honestly this is not what I expected, so I will just need time to adjust and get used to this outlook of things. To be clear - my general impression is positive, there are just couple of things that bothers me and disturbs that positivity...First thing – I do think that the music they used and the choreography are chosen/made to highlight their view on this Latin theme for SD this year, not other way around; I do get that for some it is carricature of Latin and Sheeran's music is misplaced there, but with this team and the choreographer they got to work with for SD I see the direction from where they are going. Since their breakthrough season 2014/15, their Short Dances were more of a play onto rhythms, variation on the theme posed than submitting strictly to the rules and falling into 'desired' or 'predictable' convetion for the particular theme – and this SD is no exception; the music is definitely a debatable choice (so is music for many other teams), but if they are feeling good with it, then it is all what matters. I think that the best thing is how well the choreography reflects on their way of movement, it seems to accommodate it instead of bending it into some standard. This is very 'their' interpretation, reflection of Latin-themed SD, focusing more on play with rhythm in more modern aesthetic with strong pointing on doing it in their style. From this first outing I feel that they are enjoying this dance quite much, there is confidence and committment about it. Saying that, my biggest issue is about music cuts – not the music used, pieces themselves, but how they were cut and mixed together. The lack of flow in transitions between 3 parts kind of kills for me the flow they achieve through their movement; honestly, I expected more of just 2-piece dance, starting with 'Thinking out loud', getting into 'Shape of you', not mixing it up between. It is just my personal feeling of 'accientality' of those cuts between pieces, whereas movement, choreo seems to be so well-thought, maybe I'll get used to it the more I'll watch the dance. The second thing at bothers me a bit is the lift – again, it is not about the lift itself, just my feeling that it does not fit for that program or for that particular part of the dance. I think it's too busy and too rushed just after rhythm change/music cut, I wonder how a rotational one would look like in that place, again, just my impression looking at the dance overall. About Gabriella's costume – I kind of get the effect for they were going as for having Latin referrences on their own terms and in their own range, the costume could be a part of that, along with some dance/choreo moves incorporated. The dress is a fabulous one and Gabriella is looking great, however I do feel that the 'Latin-Latin' referrence is too strong there, addressing it to the modernity of musical choice, the way choreography is designed to highlight their personal style, way of movement on first place and how Latin-simplistic (yet effective and in sync with the music chosen) Guillaume costume is. Again, this is just my personal impression and I think that the subtle Latin referrences in movement/poses/figures here and there are enough to get that balance between program effectiveness and the feel of being custom-designed for them, I am curious how Gabriella would look like in a dress/costume similar to her Waltz SD red dress, but made as two-piece (top and short, but flowy skirt) in one, vibrant colour.
Wow. II would much prefer them all to skate in black body suits in order to have a very clear look at body positions. My priority is what is going on from the knees down then I move up
It’s good that you noticed how bad S/B looked during the pattern. This section sets apart teams that are able to execute properly completed turns while in hold Compulsory dances were perfect for displaying this. Some found them boring but I think they separated the mice from the men
It’s good that you noticed how bad S/B looked during the pattern. This section sets apart teams that are able to execute properly completed turns while in hold Compulsory dances were perfect for displaying this. Some found them boring but I think they separated the mice from the men
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- Apr 5, 2016
But who is Plushy Moir? Is it a Russian-Canadian hybrid of Evgeni Plushenko + Scott Moir that is superb at singles and ice dance and can medal at 3 different Olympics while being partly bionic? I'd want to see such a cool guy, even if he only exists in your imagination.
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