2019-20 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating | Page 848 | Golden Skate

2019-20 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

KOBOT37

Match Penalty
Joined
Dec 9, 2019
uh... I am not related to FS (I started watching following FS because of Eteri and watching FS after seeing Quad Queen :biggrin:) but I have some experience with sports in General (in a post soviet country) and federations and this may be bit hard for many westerners to understand.

Sports in the western world is mostly commercial, i.e sport generates money it lives with, in such environment only things what matter are results and show, any organization working in sports need to have winners and preferably,winners who draw views.

In the most post soviet states and ex second world countries sport lives on money given by the government and in case of popular sports (football, hockey, fs,biathlon to name few in Russia's case) the flow of money is almost constant. In other words, for example Russian cross country skiing federation needs to put as many medals to the sport's minister's table as possible or they will get less money next year, Russian football federation can lose everything there is to lose and they will still get financed more or less by some amount of money.

(this post is about general situation and not exactly about FS,but if anybody is interested, you can see who sponsor's Navka's show for example, and then who owns these companies... you will quickly get to either state or some businessman close to state)

In such cases, assuming modern reminiscent of the maid of Orleans doesn't somehow find her way to chairmanship of federation, main aim of federation, as amazing and unbelievable as it may sound, is not getting best results possible but... staying under the radar while...distributing the money received from the government.

Pretty much every such sport in countries where government finances it (I have no idea how is it in China, but at least is is true in Post Soviet states) have a cancer, unremovable,unbeatable cancer in the name of Accomplished veterans. These are the people who hold influential positions and form an unbreakable chain: they have most (if not all) of votes and they can and do cover each other. These people have it fine, all of them receive fair share of government's money and make no mistake they absolutely do not want any 'new' player to enter their game. I have seen a case where influential people (not in Russia and not in FS, just an example to highlight how crazy it can get) did their best and succeeded in kicking wealthy investor out of their sports, sort of if FA tried to kick Roman Abramovich or Man City owners out of British football.

For these people, Eteri isn't a successful coach who gets medals to their country, they don't see Eteri as a coach of Yulia, Zhenya, Alina, Anna, Sasha, Aliona,Kamilla... they do not see Eteri as a coach who revolutionized ladies single's skating,but as a person who broke through gates of their backyard, disturbed their peaceful existence and most importantly, took fair share of money they deserve. Make no mistake,if these people can choose between Russia going medal-less in next 5 Olympics in FS and between Eteri sticking around, majority of these ' respectable people' will choose the first.

This is why Alina, a girl who never in her public life, did anything wrong, got so few love from 'legends of Russian figure skating',well now suddenly all of them care about her but not hard to see why. This is why Team Eteri, a Team which single handedly made Russia dominant force in Ladies FS gets so much hate.

I have no idea what will happen at nationals, I won't be surprised to see edge calls, URs and 0 GOEs all across 3A-s protocols and I won't be surprised if I see fair judging either, problem with trying to get Eteri out of the game is that she is simply too big now and doing it Under the radar (these people absolutely love term 'our (put sport here) family', yeah, they seriously think that it is their family, they need to get all that government money and people doesn't have right to know or ask questions . It's their family matter and we 'mere commoners' don't have right to say anything) is hard to impossible.

By her mere existence, Eteri went against that group of people and after that post, cold war which you could feel was going behind the closed doors spilled into open... I have no idea how will all these battles end, I just hope that kids who have been working since 3-4 years old to achieve something in sports wont be caught into crossfire.
 

Scott512

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 27, 2014
I love Ted because I think he just loves 3A-all of them. He has a special relationship to them, having seen them at 13, and 14 at their first JGPF. At skate Canada he was commentating with a co-host during the practice, Trusova was falling left and right and the snippy co-host said things were looking bad for Trusova. Ted said, "Oh you don't know this girl. She is the strongest girl I've ever seen." Then he picked her to win. (The co-host didn't even think she would make the podium)

That is just so positive and uplifting. We need more of that in figure skating especially with the Russian ladies.
 

Autumn Leaves

On the Ice
Joined
Dec 22, 2018
This concerrns WADA decision. There is possibility that only athletes who went through doping test by WADA succesfully will be invited to the Worlds. In this moment those are only Sasha, Alina and Zhenya (others were tested only by RUSADA), so the surprises may last little longer this season.

We all new this season would be a bloodbath and the team selection would be insanely difficult. But this, if it happens, would be such unexpected twist! For the sake of all these lovely, hard-working athletes, I really hope they somehow manage to stick to the sport principle.

Although ranking the top Russian ladies this season, even adhering to the sport principle, is such a difficult, heart-breaking task.
 

Edwin

СделаноВХрустальном!
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 5, 2019

Reasonable resume. Also worth adding is that many (most, all) of those sponsors use sports events as ways of 'moving' money around and some might get 'lost' on the way ...

For clarification, what is the state budget on sports? How much does the Ministry of Sport spend? https://www.minsport.gov.ru/en/

This is the proposed state budget for FY 2019 and later:https://tass.com/economy/1023618
Here you can find a spreadsheet with figures: https://www.minsport.gov.ru/activities/financial/ , 2016 shows ~70 trillion Rubles? Used to sustain the regular programs, i.e. without big events like international championships, OG, UEFA, F1 and such?

And what is the estimated gross turnover, including the sponsor contributions, of all sports combined? And of course the most interesting figure: how much actually reaches the athletes?

And it is probably childish to presume FFKKR is free from these people and practices, no matter their anti-corruption program on the website home page.

Indeed one feels sorry for the kids, some of who will sooner or later fall into the trap when they rise in the ranks and become professionally involved in governing, controlling or leading their sport.
 
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Edwin

СделаноВХрустальном!
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 5, 2019
We all new this season would be a bloodbath and the team selection would be insanely difficult. But this, if it happens, would be such unexpected twist! For the sake of all these lovely, hard-working athletes, I really hope they somehow manage to stick to the sport principle.

Although ranking the top Russian ladies this season, even adhering to the sport principle, is such a difficult, heart-breaking task.

In theory, the WADA status of an athlete shouldn't influence National Championships (does FFKKR still acknowledge RUSADA?) and even team selection right now, and any ordered ban might come into effect only after 2020 Worlds, given the CAS appeals.

We must sincerely hope ISU got its act together and acquired enough clean samples off our figure skaters to satisfy any WADA criteria.
 

ruga

Final Flight
Joined
Oct 20, 2017
That is just so positive and uplifting. We need more of that in figure skating especially with the Russian ladies.

Sinistina getting to Russian team would probably be the craziest moment of the season (or maybe they would tell Alina to come back?).
 

Scott512

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 27, 2014
uh... I am not related to FS (I started watching following FS because of Eteri and watching FS after seeing Quad Queen :biggrin:) but I have some experience with sports in General (in a post soviet country) and federations and this may be bit hard for many westerners to understand.

Sports in the western world is mostly commercial, i.e sport generates money it lives with, in such environment only things what matter are results and show, any organization working in sports need to have winners and preferably,winners who draw views.

In the most post soviet states and ex second world countries sport lives on money given by the government and in case of popular sports (football, hockey, fs,biathlon to name few in Russia's case) the flow of money is almost constant. In other words, for example Russian cross country skiing federation needs to put as many medals to the sport's minister's table as possible or they will get less money next year, Russian football federation can lose everything there is to lose and they will still get financed more or less by some amount of money.

(this post is about general situation and not exactly about FS,but if anybody is interested, you can see who sponsor's Navka's show for example, and then who owns these companies... you will quickly get to either state or some businessman close to state)

In such cases, assuming modern reminiscent of the maid of Orleans doesn't somehow find her way to chairmanship of federation, main aim of federation, as amazing and unbelievable as it may sound, is not getting best results possible but... staying under the radar while...distributing the money received from the government.

Pretty much every such sport in countries where government finances it (I have no idea how is it in China, but at least is is true in Post Soviet states) have a cancer, unremovable,unbeatable cancer in the name of Accomplished veterans. These are the people who hold influential positions and form an unbreakable chain: they have most (if not all) of votes and they can and do cover each other. These people have it fine, all of them receive fair share of government's money and make no mistake they absolutely do not want any 'new' player to enter their game. I have seen a case where influential people (not in Russia and not in FS, just an example to highlight how crazy it can get) did their best and succeeded in kicking wealthy investor out of their sports, sort of if FA tried to kick Roman Abramovich or Man City owners out of British football.

For these people, Eteri isn't a successful coach who gets medals to their country, they don't see Eteri as a coach of Yulia, Zhenya, Alina, Anna, Sasha, Aliona,Kamilla... they do not see Eteri as a coach who revolutionized ladies single's skating,but as a person who broke through gates of their backyard, disturbed their peaceful existence and most importantly, took fair share of money they deserve. Make no mistake,if these people can choose between Russia going medal-less in next 5 Olympics in FS and between Eteri sticking around, majority of these ' respectable people' will choose the first.

This is why Alina, a girl who never in her public life, did anything wrong, got so few love from 'legends of Russian figure skating',well now suddenly all of them care about her but not hard to see why. This is why Team Eteri, a Team which single handedly made Russia dominant force in Ladies FS gets so much hate.

I have no idea what will happen at nationals, I won't be surprised to see edge calls, URs and 0 GOEs all across 3A-s protocols and I won't be surprised if I see fair judging either, problem with trying to get Eteri out of the game is that she is simply too big now and doing it Under the radar (these people absolutely love term 'our (put sport here) family', yeah, they seriously think that it is their family, they need to get all that government money and people doesn't have right to know or ask questions . It's their family matter and we 'mere commoners' don't have right to say anything) is hard to impossible.

By her mere existence, Eteri went against that group of people and after that post, cold war which you could feel was going behind the closed doors spilled into open... I have no idea how will all these battles end, I just hope that kids who have been working since 3-4 years old to achieve something in sports wont be caught into crossfire.

Oh my God this is an unbelievable post especially about how eteri broke through the fence into their backyards. It sounds dramatic and a touch of violent but it's very true this Warrior Princess coach has invaded other territories and taking names and numbers. Eteri is the murderess of CSKA ladies program! She really does slay doesn't she? ;)
 

nussnacker

one and only
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 16, 2019
From my experience athletes get tested at each event, no matter how big or small.
All top 3 will always get tested and then some randomly within top 10.
Besides, they can also be tested randomly when they’re not participating in the events.
 

Edwin

СделаноВХрустальном!
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 5, 2019
In all ISU competitions there can be random tests but the top three medalists are always tested. So Medvedeva and Tuktamysheva will also have been tested in China, the USA and Canada.

This happens in CS competitions too.

Pff, I am feeling a little relieved, so Aleksandra, Anna and Alyona have a sufficient number of clean samples in their WADA records and should be safe from exclusion.
 

silverfoxes

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 16, 2014
So Johnny discusses a comment about a high level skater not knowing what to do with her life in a conversation that happened sometime before the GPF. And now Zhenya is working on designing costumes. To me that suggests she is already considering next steps in her career.

I also remember Johnny mentioning conversations with Zhenya during his Olympic commentary. It’s been a while but the way he phrased certain things gave me the impression they potentially were close.

She did some athletic wear designs a couple years ago. She's always been creative. All skaters surely consider what they will do with themselves after their career ends (at least I would hope so, because it could happen at any time), but just because someone has hobbies and interests outside of the ice doesn't mean they are on the verge of quitting.
 

katymay

Medalist
Joined
Mar 7, 2006
From my experience athletes get tested at each event, no matter how big or small.
All top 3 will always get tested and then some randomly within top 10.
Besides, they can also be tested randomly when they’re not participating in the events.

What I think Raf is saying is it might not have been in time. In which case, Alina will enjoy the shortest retirement in history. And really, she has plenty of time to get back into shape if they need her for Worlds.
 

DSQ

Record Breaker
Joined
Apr 14, 2018
Country
United-Kingdom
Pff, so Aleksandra, Anna and Alyona have a sufficient number clean samples in their WADA records and should be safe from exclusion.

Definitely. Same goes for all Russian medalists at the GP and CS events. Skaters like Samodurova, Konstantinova and Sotnikova might be okay but we’ll have to wait for the list to update.

I’m not sure who has spread this rumour but considering there are a small number of foreign athletes that train in Russia like the Spanish Dance team wouldn’t they have to worry too?
 

Edwin

СделаноВХрустальном!
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 5, 2019
Definitely. Same goes for all Russian medalists at the GP and CS events. Skaters like Samodurova, Konstantinova and Sotnikova might be okay but we’ll have to wait for the list to update.

I’m not sure who has spread this rumour but considering there are a small number of foreign athletes that train in Russia like the Spanish Dance team wouldn’t they have to worry too?

Well, RUSADA lost its accreditation, despite being fully complaint and trusted since its restructuring. But all their test results were annulled, right? So if those foreigners have no other test results than RUSADA's, they are at the mercy of WADA.
 
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