Changes on US team for Worlds

[Tavi...]

Ashley fans just can’t catch a break! US fed really effed it up in choosing Karen over Ashley for both the Olympics and the worlds team. Technically since they give out pewter medals Ashley was on the podium at nationals so they should have put her in worlds. Anyone paying attention to Karen this season saw this coming a mile away. She had a worse season then Ashley(and really any of the top us ladies) and was gifted majorly by the judges at nationals because she didn’t have a train wreck meltdown. Now they will pay the price because there’s no way we retain three spots unless some of the big girls have meltdowns. It didn’t have to be this way!

And to be completely honest, yes the double standard is ridiculous. Jason had no business being the first alternate body of work or not. It was once again US fed playing games and giving out major gifts. He gave no legitimate reason as to why he would turn this opportunity down. And yet! I barely saw one bad word said against him. I get it he’s Jason and sweet and nice and not abrasive like Ashley but come on.

So to summarize, Ashley wuzrobbed, her fans wuzrobbed, USFS is useless and corrupt and they’ll get what’s coming to them when they lose 3 spots, and Karen and Jason are talentless losers - is that about it?

Heres a gentle reminder: just because Jason didn’t announce his reasons for declining the Worlds spot publicly - or to you personally - doesn’t mean they don’t exist, or he didn’t explain them to the people who mattered.

And just because you’re disappointed or angry on Ashley’s behalf doesn’t mean you have to trash other skaters. Really.

 

[brightphoton]

Okay, my bad. I don't even know what I am confusing this with.

You're probably confusing it with the men's Olympic and World's and 4CC team, which were a complete and total mess, as far as Nationals rankings went.

Silver medalist Ross didn't get on the World or Olympic team, didn't get first alternate position either.

Jason Brown was 6th or something at Nationals, and was first alternate, and he ended up deciding not to go to World's anyway.

 

[ancientpeas]

You're probably confusing it with the men's Olympic and World's and 4CC team, which were a complete and total mess, as far as Nationals rankings went.

Silver medalist Ross didn't get on the World or Olympic team, didn't get first alternate position either.

Jason Brown was 6th or something at Nationals, and was first alternate, and he ended up deciding not to go to World's anyway.

I thought Jason was 5th.

 

[StitchMonkey]

I thought Jason was 5th.

No, Grant was 5th.

 

[evasorange]

Couple of things here. First, Jason didn't whine and whinge and carry on about how unfair it was that he didn't get to go to the Olympics. Instead, he accepted his spot at 4CC and went and was cheerful and skated great and ended his season on a brilliant high. It also meant he was in skating shape for the Olys which he was first alternate for. And his social media has also shown him at various rinks since the Olympics, obviously skating. He then proceeded to wish Team USA luck and continued on with his plans.

Ashley, meanwhile, spent quite a bit of time griping about the Olympics, then threw away the spot at 4CC the USFS gave her, did not appear to be skating or training before or after the Olympics but rather doing media gigs, and does not appear to have been training according to her social media.

And you wonder why they're treated differently.



For the ten thousandth time, THEY DIDN'T PASS ROSS FOR WORLDS. THEY OFFERED THE SPOT TO ROSS AND ROSS SAID NO. That was how Max got the spot.
They gave Ross 4CC. He turned it down.

They offered Ross the Worlds spot. He turned it down.

Ross' lack of a post-Nationals assignment is HIS FAULT, not USFS'.

Ok, First off I wouldn’t call two interviews (immediately after her skate at nationals and the one at access Hollywood a few days later) “whining and winging and carrying on” but you do you. Second, Ashley WAS treated unfairly. Her coach said this, Charlie white said this. They are knowledgeable about this subject. But you don’t have to be an expert to see this, Anybody who understands anything about pcs reputation scores and international judging can see this. You don’t have to be an Ashley fan to understand that she was judged on a different scale then Bradie, Mirai and Karen. But all that’s been broken down many times already. I admit I don’t know why she didn’t accept 4 continents, but just because she never came out and gave us a contex of why she wasn’t going I wouldn’t use the phrase “throwing it away” by that logic we can say Jason is throwing away his chance for worlds. By following her social media and reading between the lines my guess is that she was really really hurt by everything that went down at nationals and tried to continue to train(hence the comment “I’m training for a competition” comment shortly after nationals) but ultimately found it too much/couldn’t get get the drive and thus gave up her spots because she knew she wasn’t well trained enough. But I know it’s much more for fun for this board to put a villainous slant to her actions instead.

And yeah of course Jason isn’t complaining of unfairness-why would he?! He got the most favoritism of all from us fed! I love Jason as a skater and a person but the fact is he did one clean triple axel and no quads at nationals. He should have never been the first alternate. It was a gift from the fed pure and simple.

 

[evasorange]

So to summarize, Ashley wuzrobbed, her fans wuzrobbed, USFS is useless and corrupt and they’ll get what’s coming to them when they lose 3 spots, and Karen and Jason are talentless losers - is that about it?

Heres a gentle reminder: just because Jason didn’t announce his reasons for declining the Worlds spot publicly - or to you personally - doesn’t mean they don’t exist, or he didn’t explain them to the people who mattered.

And just because you’re disappointed or angry on Ashley’s behalf doesn’t mean you have to trash other skaters. Really.

Sis if you think that’s me trashing other skaters.. and how you got that I think Karen and Jason are talentless losers from that I’m not 100 percent sure that’s what we call a reach lol I like Karen! I wish she would get it together! But look at her season. It’s not happening and after everything she’s put out this season it’s pretty unrealistic to think she is gonna all of a sudden just gonna pull It together next week for worlds. Especially after she was just complaining again about boot problems on instagram last week..like it was just a better strategy to put Ashley on one of the teams. She’s not at her peak but she was still the only other woman besides Bradie to get a Grand Prix medal this year. She perfromed better at nationals then she had all year suggesting that she was on an upswing. Karen was always a gamble to put on both Olympic and worlds teams.

And Ashley didn’t have to give a reason for declining but she did and still look at the phrases and names being thrown around here “unprofessional” “whining” nobody said anything like that about Jason when he withdrew. And he didn’t even give an explanation!

 

[Mrs. P]

Anyway, neither Jason nor Ashley are on the U.S. World Team at this point. They both had reasons to turn down the opportunity. They both have fans who will surely enjoy them on Stars on Ice in a few weeks. I won't beat any more dead horses further.

I'm delighted to hear that Mariah has an opportunity to do an international competition with the love of her life and what a great opportunity for Stellato/Barthomay to get more exposure on such a big stage -- though I hope Tarah's OK -- they did so great at 4CC, I was hoping that could be a launching pad for them at Worlds.

 

[Ice Dance]

The question is whether he should have been awarded the spot outright. Turning down a spot is different than turning down a spot as an alternate, if for no other reason than he would have no guarantee that he would be attending and may be training hard for nothing. I don't usually disagree strongly with how the USFSA handles assignments, but I think they blew it here; 4CC isn't a good enough consolation prize for a silver medalist when there are 6 Olympic and World spots to go around.

I agree that there is a difference between training for an event for which you have secured a spot and training for one for which you can only hope to compete.

But short of changing the criteria, Ross didn't really have an argument. Not against any of the guys ranked above him. The selection committee followed the criteria.

We may not like the criteria and we can argue against its continuation, but the selection committee followed it.

*Having said all of this, if you are an alternate in an Olympic year, you know the odds are much higher than during a regular season that you may get the call.

 

[labgoat]

I 'think' I liked LLL, but I never saw the movie and Tara wouldn't shut up at the opening so I have no idea what the words were that were spoken.

The voice over is ...and she smiled.

 

[drivingmissdaisy]

But short of changing the criteria, Ross didn't really have an argument. Not against any of the guys ranked above him. The selection committee followed the criteria.

We may not like the criteria and we can argue against its continuation, but the selection committee followed it.

I think even that is arguable. Jason had a good season, no doubt. However, there is a huge difference between placing 2nd and 6th at Nationals. Had Jason finished 3rd or 4th, it would be a different story. Basically, Nationals was treated as completely meaningless instead of a Tier I selection event.

 

[Mrs. P]

I think even that is arguable. Jason had a good season, no doubt. However, there is a huge difference between placing 2nd and 6th at Nationals. Had Jason finished 3rd or 4th, it would be a different story. Basically, Nationals was treated as completely meaningless instead of a Tier I selection event.

Probably the best way to spilt the difference was to give Ross Worlds/1st Alternate Olympics, Adam the Olympics and Jason 1st Alternate Worlds. Or you could switch World/Olympics between Ross or Adam.

I think Tier 1 Nationals could be argued as meaningless for Ross -- but I think it made the difference for Vincent. They could have gone BOW and kicked him off the team, but they kept him on.

 

[oatmella]

With how the Olympics went, it seems reasonable to say that the right team was chosen. I'm not sure giving Ross Worlds would have made a huge difference to him - he was aiming to make the Olympic team.
Vincent ended up doing well at the Olympics so it's not like it can be argued at this point that he didn't deserve to be there. I'm sure many would have thought that he wouldn't have finished ahead of skaters like Patrick Chan, Kolyada and Aliev, but he placed a very respectable 6th.
It may not seem fair the way the team was chosen, but I don't think better results would have been achieved with a different team.

 

[Ice Dance]

I think even that is arguable. Jason had a good season, no doubt. However, there is a huge difference between placing 2nd and 6th at Nationals. Had Jason finished 3rd or 4th, it would be a different story. Basically, Nationals was treated as completely meaningless instead of a Tier I selection event.

Jason defeats Ross on other Tier I selection criteria.

Which essentially means it comes down to more than just one event for them both. And Jason wins the rest of the criteria. As far as I can recall. It's been a while since I looked at it, but Jason had a very solid argument based on multiple results. If the 6th place hadn't been taken into consideration, he would probably have had a good argument against Adam & Vincent. So I'm pretty sure Nationals results & placements were taken into account.

 

[Skater Boy]

Based on retweets both Tarah and Danny made, and Danny's very general "best of luck" on Twitter, my hunch is that this withdrawal was not something they wanted to do, nor do they have anything to gain by skipping Worlds (while I like S/B and am happy for them, the US does probably run a greater risk now of dropping to one pairs spot; it could hurt K/O with the GP selection process; etc.). Not sure why their situation is being grouped in with those of skaters who are very deliberately bypassing Worlds due to a surfeit of media opportunities/lack of training time/possible retirement (Adam, Shibs, Ashley) or a training change/plans to get started on next season (Jason).

I think as we go down the list we need to use names more than ever. S/B Stepanova Bukin and Seguin and Bilodeau and now the Americans.

 

[Skater Boy]

In life I have never been very lucky or talented or skilled. I have been given so many opportunities by working hard, volunteering to help out and persevering as others dropped out for various reasons. I am not a great athlete but I have gone to nationals for Ultimate Frisbee 8 times by just being ready and willing. It is sad in some ways some people don't take advantage of the blessings they have been given but it opens the door for another soul.

But yes, Mariah and S/B certainly do not on paper help USA's chances of gaining or retaining spots.

 

[Lenny318]

I'm shocked and kinda concerned that Karen withdrew from Worlds. From her posts following the Olympics I would have guessed she wanted to make a statement and end the season on a better note in Italy while Mirai would more likely withdraw with all the media attention, an Olympic medal, and the title of first American woman to land a triple axel at the Olympics.

 

[bubblecherry]

Mirai has been posting instagram stories of her at the rink nearly every day since she got back from the Oscars.

 

[Tavi...]

Probably the best way to spilt the difference was to give Ross Worlds/1st Alternate Olympics, Adam the Olympics and Jason 1st Alternate Worlds. Or you could switch World/Olympics between Ross or Adam.

I think Tier 1 Nationals could be argued as meaningless for Ross -- but I think it made the difference for Vincent. They could have gone BOW and kicked him off the team, but they kept him on.

I think the problem for Ross was that his Nats 2018 result was simply too much of an outlier for USFS to feel comfortable sending him to Worlds (spots on the line) or having him back up Nathan in the team event (medals on the line). So it really came down to Ross vs Vincent for the “results don’t really matter” spots. They were less than a point apart, but Vincent had the Junior Worlds win and a higher average score than Ross by quite a bit - and more importantly, he probably had a lot of well connected people lobbying for him. They could have split Worlds / Olympics between Vincent and Ross, but they didn’t. It’s too bad.

 

[geige]

Mirai has been posting instagram stories of her at the rink nearly every day since she got back from the Oscars.

Welcome to GS! Unfortunately, this is the land where Mirai making a joke about Dancing With the Stars post-competition in an attempt to lighten up the spirit means that she hates skating, doesn’t take it seriously, will drop her obligations at the drop of a hat for some fame, is ready to wash her hands of skating and lose the 3rd spot, and really just give USFSA and the rest of American figure skating fans the middle finger. Fortunately, it does lead to many pointless arguments over 40 pages long and hyperanalyses of her behavior that all come to the same conclusion.

And I wish I were exaggerating.

 

[cruzceleste]

Welcome to GS! Unfortunately, this is the land where Mirai making a joke about Dancing With the Stars post-competition in an attempt to lighten up the spirit means that she hates skating, doesn’t take it seriously, will drop her obligations at the drop of a hat for some fame, is ready to wash her hands of skating and lose the 3rd spot, and really just give USFSA and the rest of American figure skating fans the middle finger. Fortunately, it does lead to many pointless arguments over 40 pages long and hyperanalyses of her behavior that all come to the same conclusion.

And I wish I were exaggerating.

To be fair every skater has at some point faced backlash for something they have said/ done or is in the mind of another skater´s fans... you just need to look in the internet or this forum to find enough evidence of biased or judgmental behavior from skating fans...

A skater can be over pimped, over hipper, over confidence, undeserving, whining, don´t care enough, too technical, not enough technical, too boring , or not have personality at all, not know what music fix him/ her, or always picking the same music... welcome to the marvelous world of the Internet... enjoy the ride and bring pop corn you will have more fun that way