2016 Europeans Men Free Skate

[Mirunna]

I can't believe the amount of hate Fernandez gets for his scores. Yes he did mistakes, but he updated his technical content - he is freakingly going for two 4S, one 4T and two 3A in the LP. Besides Hanyu, no one comes even close to his content. This means, point-wise, he has cushion to make mistakes and his score would still be huge. A fall on a rotated 3A gives him more or less the points his former clean 3T did. This is COP. I can't argue PCS as this is a very subjective theme and to each his own, but his TES? Come on! Give the guy some credit. On a related note, his 4S in the LP were particularly fabulous! So easy and smooth!
With respect to his 4T GOE (while I don't agree), I remember someone explaining to me why V/T's two footed throws got in the post positive GOE also (height, entry, air position may give you +2 and +3 goe and if the landing is two footed, you deduct the GOE to 0 or +.1 I might be wrong on the explanation, but I am certain that +GOE on a jump with an error is not that uncommon and Fernandez wasn't first to get it).
I think that for the first time with his new content, Fernandez had a wonderful competition and I love to see how his confidence is slowly after winning worlds instead of plummeting like we have seen with other world champions (Liza ). He does not appear to be too spooked about Hanyu's rising and he is not about to go down without a fight!

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

-1 from positive GOE ? GOE is applied from 0 positive or negative, not -1 from positive 1. This should have been -1 on the boards. How there can have been applied any positive GOEs if he didn't landed it cleanly and put hand down on landing.

m
Lol...positive GOE takes many things into consideration. You can have many positive aspects of a jump like height, flow, difficult entry, air position that are factored against the negatives. Judges are supposed to weigh the positives first and subtract the negatives second. At least...that's what the ISU guidelines say. Hand down is not required to be negative GOE.

I'm completely fine with him getting 00.14 extra in points.

 

[HanDomi]

so let's start giving out positive GOEs for falls because jump was beatifull in the air.

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

so let's start giving out positive GOEs for falls because jump was beatifull in the air.

I've been saying that for years. Positive GOE for spectacular falls but -3 to -5 pts for falling!

 

[ranran]

Since Olympic I always thought Men's singles is falling around so much because they are pushing on towards a new boundaries but once they are comfortable with the changes it will get stable again, with this competition I can see that its starting to get to that point. Its not enough to fall on quad and win anymore because others has started to stabilize their quads, they have to landed it to be in contention. Congrats to Javi, Bychenko and Kovtun! World is going to be fascinating!

 

[Sorrento]

FYI they've let him choose his music before. This season's music was offered to him and he liked it very much so they went with it.

Then it was offered after all. This is my point. I wonder if he listens to a lot of other muic at all. He's a talented young guy and I wish he was more up to date in his overall presentation- both musically and aesthetically (here comes the costumes).

 

[Sugarpova]

Idk if its late but u can still do this:agree:
https://twitter.com/ISU_Figure/status/692817974391087104

I wish he was more up to date in his overall presentation- both musically and aesthetically (here comes the costumes).

I dont think up to date is always the best
Like compare Beyonce & The Beatles

 

[adelia]

Then it was offered after all. This is my point. I wonder if he listens to a lot of other muic at all. He's a talented young guy and I wish he was more up to date in his overall presentation- both musically and aesthetically (here comes the costumes).

Oh please, he listens to various types of music and he goes to the theatre to watch ballet etc as well. Don't try to paint a picture of him that's negative when you've never even read most of his interviews or followed his career. He's said before that he and Mishin have disagreements about presentation, which is normal. And sometimes Mishin adopts changes based on what Sasha says. He's not some robot or tool that is controlled by Mishin. So what if his music this season so happens was suggested by someone else, has that never ever happened before for other skaters? Give me a break. And his FS costume is gorgeous. His SP costume could be better but unlike plenty of other skaters who may make one wrong costume choice at the beginning of the season, Petrov doesn't get enough funding to make a new one. His PCS at Euros was also by no means low for an unhyped 16 year old debutant.

 

[Perdita]

ISU changed the rule this season to abolish mandatory negative GOEs. With regard to jumps, I assume their incentive is to differentiate a quality jump (with transitions, good air position, height etc.) followed by fall, step out, hands down etc, from the mediocre jump followed by those mistakes. Probably, one of the reasons that we're seeing some inconsistencies and discrepancy with fan's view regarding GOEs is that the judges are still at the halfway understanding and applying the new GOE guidelines. That's my view...

 

[seniorita]

During Europeans I m even more excited cause I can finally watch skating on my tv, in a normal time -frame :hap93:
Amodio brought me to tears, what an amazing free skate, the best way to leave competitions!<3 A friend pointed me out to watch Vassiljevs , so I did and I loved him! Has something of Lambiel!
And I m a fan of Samohin, never seen him before!

 

[Jaana]

Congratulations to Fernandez for winning his 4th European title, Bychenko for his first European medal and Kovtun for the bronze medal!!! Sad that Amodio and Kolyada did not do better in sp, but unfortunately a good freeskate is not always enough.

 

[Sorrento]

Oh please, he listens to various types of music and he goes to the theatre to watch ballet etc as well. Don't try to paint a picture of him that's negative when you've never even read most of his interviews or followed his career. He's said before that he and Mishin have disagreements about presentation, which is normal. And sometimes Mishin adopts changes based on what Sasha says. He's not some robot or tool that is controlled by Mishin. So what if his music this season so happens was suggested by someone else, has that never ever happened before for other skaters? Give me a break. And his FS costume is gorgeous. His SP costume could be better but unlike plenty of other skaters who may make one wrong costume choice at the beginning of the season, Petrov doesn't get enough funding to make a new one. His PCS at Euros was also by no means low for an unhyped 16 year old debutant.

First of all- cool down. All the comments I've been exchanging during the competition with another poster were humorous. Second- did I say anything about PCS? No! Third- I am not a hater of his. I have a viewpoint which I shared in a polite way saying sorry at the beginning of it. So I will not give you a break. No.

 

[coldblueeyes]

Are we sure now? You don't think the GPF has in a way been fixed? Really, answer me this, did you see ANY other outcome other than Hanyu winning and Javier getting silver? And it's not just him either. There are several instances of this with other skaters.

No, I don't. I can say the event was overscored in all Senior disciplines, but rigged, no. And what did Hanyu or Fernandez deserve other than first and second? I'm sorry but the others were not up to par. A difference of 15+ points between second and third, and a difference of 50+ points between first and third is not something they can create out of nowhere.

 

[NoNameFace]

I can't believe the amount of hate Fernandez gets for his scores. Yes he did mistakes, but he updated his technical content - he is freakingly going for two 4S, one 4T and two 3A in the LP. Besides Hanyu, no one comes even close to his content. This means, point-wise, he has cushion to make mistakes and his score would still be huge. A fall on a rotated 3A gives him more or less the points his former clean 3T did. This is COP. I can't argue PCS as this is a very subjective theme and to each his own, but his TES? Come on! Give the guy some credit. On a related note, his 4S in the LP were particularly fabulous! So easy and smooth!
With respect to his 4T GOE (while I don't agree), I remember someone explaining to me why V/T's two footed throws got in the post positive GOE also (height, entry, air position may give you +2 and +3 goe and if the landing is two footed, you deduct the GOE to 0 or +.1 I might be wrong on the explanation, but I am certain that +GOE on a jump with an error is not that uncommon and Fernandez wasn't first to get it).
I think that for the first time with his new content, Fernandez had a wonderful competition and I love to see how his confidence is slowly after winning worlds instead of plummeting like we have seen with other world champions (Liza ). He does not appear to be too spooked about Hanyu's rising and he is not about to go down without a fight!

I agree - he gambles on more, then the margin of potential mistakes widens to stay in contention especially when others do not have equal goods to offer/have them, but can't perform.

His performance yesterday was really sublime and entertaining (aside of 4T slip), overall I consider his SP/FS season set as a best from him yet - both programs are bringing his best qualities, athleticism and showman's flare to their best. And the moment between 4S and step sequence with checking watch - just magnificent! What amazes me even more is what you've pointed above - he seems not very affected by Hanyu's records/actions, I sense he's more relaxed and engaged in his performances with upped tech contents in BOTH programs. A big big kudos for Brian - he's really an amazing coach and the way he's dealing with two top guys now is really a thing to admire - both are constantly developing, are still competition and success hungry.

 

[Watermelondrea]

No, I don't. I can say the event was overscored in all Senior disciplines, but rigged, no. And what did Hanyu or Fernandez deserve other than first and second? I'm sorry but the others were not up to par. A difference of 15+ points between second and third, and a difference of 50+ points between first and third is not something they can create out of nowhere.

@javisshortprogram

 

[solani]

I agree - he gambles on more, then the margin of potential mistakes widens to stay in contention especially when others do not have equal goods to offer/have them, but can't perform.

His performance yesterday was really sublime and entertaining (aside of 4T slip), overall I consider his SP/FS season set as a best from him yet - both programs are bringing his best qualities, athleticism and showman's flare to their best. And the moment between 4S and step sequence with checking watch - just magnificent! What amazes me even more is what you've pointed above - he seems not very affected by Hanyu's records/actions, I sense he's more relaxed and engaged in his performances with upped tech contents in BOTH programs. A big big kudos for Brian - he's really an amazing coach and the way he's dealing with two top guys now is really a thing to admire - both are constantly developing, are still competition and success hungry.

I agree and I always get the impression that with Javier it's all about his own performance. I'm sure he likes to win, but it's not necessary for him to be satisfied with himself. And he's giving himself every chance to win. I'm sure he knows perfectly well that he cannot beat a clean Hanyu, but he can beat a Hanyu with one or two mistakes. He's a great guy and he's going for all the content even if he doesn't need to. What a treat for the fans!

 

[lauravvv]

So a hand down crappy quad, an obviously ur 3a and sloppy 3lo but 10 in performance?

Tell me the judges are not blind

How many time this has to be repeated to people? Please go on the ISU site and read the criteria for the Performance/Execution component. It has much less to do with the execution of technical elements than you obviously think - even the Execution part of it. There is GOE for that.

Of course, really disruptive falls and other serious mistakes do influence the PCS somewhat, because, for example, if there is a fall and a really long getup from it, the choreography/the rest of the program outside of jumps and spins can't be executed the way it is intended. But mistakes that don't prevent skaters from executing the rest of the program really have nothing to do with the Performance/Execution component. They can still influence the PCS somewhat if the particular judges feel that those mistakes have taken away from the impression of/from the program. But that is not in the rules, so, if judges feel that those mistakes have not spoiled the impression of the program for them, they are free to award the performance with the same PCS that they would have given if there were no mistakes.

 

[coldblueeyes]

@javisshortprogram

Yes, fifteen points difference just in the short.

 

[MIM]

sorry wrong thread!

 

[Sugarpova]

+ haha saw on another forum
Onlooker's perspective on Florozov!:luv17:
Nikolay Morozov during best ever performance of Florant Amodio Bratislava European Championship 2016